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Does Harold deserve to be picked on by Duncan and Courtney so much?

Does Harold deserve to be picked on so much?

  • Avatar of Brodoin15

    Brodoin15

    [401]Oct 10, 2009
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    Diddy_2000 wrote:
    Brodoin15 wrote:
    1. Duncan - Had Duncan not messed with Harold, nothing would have happened. Plain and simple

    That is like saying.

    "If Harold hadn't switched the votes it wouldn't have happened. Plain and simple."

    No, it wouldn't have.

    But Duncan choose to start the whole thing with his pranks on Harold. He didn't need to do them. They just got Harold so mad and upset, he wasn't thinking straight.

    Diddy_2000 wrote:
    Brodoin15 wrote:
    2. Chris - Chris saw that Harold cheated, but he choose to do nothing.

    Aaand?

    And that is why Courtney didn't get to come back. Chris let is slide, so he also cheated Courtney.

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  • Avatar of alagaesian

    alagaesian

    [402]Oct 10, 2009
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    Here's an interesting way to think about things:

    There are many reasons why Courtney tried to resist Duncan. First, she tried to talk herself out of it by saying that she couldn't feel attraction to someone who broke rules often. Then, she was too proud to admit that she was wrong about it all and that she is going crazy for him. One of the reasons she tried to resist him, I propose, was that she didn't want to associate herself with someone who broke the rules. It wouldn't help in her political career, and she'd get in trouble more often if people saw her in a different light, where, hey look, she's going out with a juvie delinquent.

    When she hooks up with Duncan, she associates herself with a rule-breaker and takes full responsibility for any reputation she gets through it. So, technically, she took the risk that someone would hate her for her boyfriend and treat her with disrespect because of it. This risk just happened to come up with bad consequences.

    I don't look at the issue this way, it's just something to think about. Courtney doesn't want to break the rules because she doesn't want the punishment. Duncan tries to show her that the punishment isn't so bad and that breaking rules can have positive consequences. So she finally 'goes over to the dark side' and gets burned for it. I know someone's going to walk all over this post and claim it all as irrelevant, but it's just another element of the debate that could be discussed.
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  • Avatar of imverybasic

    imverybasic

    [403]Oct 10, 2009
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    BrainMan820 wrote:
    It's quite obvious that Harold was bad at dodgeball: Leshawna threw him out with absolutely no effort, and his attempt at a throw was absolutely pathetic. It makes perfect sense given Harold's complete lack of "wicked skills." She also didn't showcase his bad arm to the entire team: Harold did that himself. If Courtney had "given Harold a chance" they would have lost.

    This is completely un-true. Harold ended up taking the victory for his team. He showed that he was able to both dodge and catch the balls thrown directly at him. If anyone tries to respond with "Harold only got one person out", it's only because he wasn't given enough of a chance to compete. Which only proves that if he was given a chance to other stuff outside of the throwing the ball in the first place, his team would have won. The fact that Harold couldn't throw the ball didn't make him bad at dodgeball, it just made him bad at throwing.

    And no Harold did not do that to himself. Courtney grabbed his arm and made it quite clear that his arms weren't strong enough to push the canoes in "Up The Creek" when all she could have said was that they were looking for someone strong to push the canoes and keep Harold's strength out of it. She didn't have to humiliate him in front of his entire team.

    BrainMan820 wrote:
    And tampering with the votes still makes no sense. By your logic, Duncan would have probably tormented or hurt Harold if Harold cheated off Duncan, and Duncan found out. Well, what makes Harold think things would be any different if he cheats off Duncan's girlfriend? What, does he think Duncan is just going to let it slide? Or that Courtney wouldn't seek her own revenge?

    It works the other way around, too. If Harold would have cheated out Duncan instead of Courtney, Courtney would have penalized Harold for trying to cheat off her boyfriend.

    You keep saying that my logic makes no sense. You're saying that it's alright for Harold to be picked on, just because he was trying to make Duncan suffer, when all the while, Duncan was trying to make Harold suffer from the beginning.

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  • Avatar of Diddy_2000

    Diddy_2000

    [404]Oct 10, 2009
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    imverybasic wrote:

    BrainMan820 wrote:
    It's quite obvious that Harold was bad at dodgeball: Leshawna threw him out with absolutely no effort, and his attempt at a throw was absolutely pathetic. It makes perfect sense given Harold's complete lack of "wicked skills." She also didn't showcase his bad arm to the entire team: Harold did that himself. If Courtney had "given Harold a chance" they would have lost.

    This is completely un-true. Harold ended up taking the victory for his team. He showed that he was able to both dodge and catch the balls thrown directly at him. If anyone tries to respond with "Harold only got one person out", it's only because he wasn't given enough of a chance to compete. Which only proves that if he was given a chance to other stuff outside of the throwing the ball in the first place, his team would have won. The fact that Harold couldn't throw the ball didn't make him bad at dodgeball, it just made him bad at throwing.

    And no Harold did not do that to himself. Courtney grabbed his arm and made it quite clear that his arms weren't strong enough to push the canoes in "Up The Creek" when all she could have said was that they were looking for someone strong to push the canoes and keep Harold's strength out of it. She didn't have to humiliate him in front of his entire team.

    BrainMan820 wrote:
    And tampering with the votes still makes no sense. By your logic, Duncan would have probably tormented or hurt Harold if Harold cheated off Duncan, and Duncan found out. Well, what makes Harold think things would be any different if he cheats off Duncan's girlfriend? What, does he think Duncan is just going to let it slide? Or that Courtney wouldn't seek her own revenge?

    It works the other way around, too. If Harold would have cheated out Duncan instead of Courtney, Courtney would have penalized Harold for trying to cheat off her boyfriend.

    You keep saying that my logic makes no sense. You're saying that it's alright for Harold to be picked on, just because he was trying to make Duncan suffer, when all the while, Duncan was trying to make Harold suffer from the beginning.



    He failed extremely in one dodgeball challenged.

    And did good in another one.

    You have NO evidence saying "If Harold was in more he'd be all that awesome LOL LOL"
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  • Avatar of Brodoin15

    Brodoin15

    [405]Oct 10, 2009
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    Well, you also do not have any evidence to show he'd totally suck.
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  • Avatar of n5d25d90

    n5d25d90

    [406]Oct 10, 2009
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    Diddy_2000 wrote:
    imverybasic wrote:

    BrainMan820 wrote:
    It's quite obvious that Harold was bad at dodgeball: Leshawna threw him out with absolutely no effort, and his attempt at a throw was absolutely pathetic. It makes perfect sense given Harold's complete lack of "wicked skills." She also didn't showcase his bad arm to the entire team: Harold did that himself. If Courtney had "given Harold a chance" they would have lost.

    This is completely un-true. Harold ended up taking the victory for his team. He showed that he was able to both dodge and catch the balls thrown directly at him. If anyone tries to respond with "Harold only got one person out", it's only because he wasn't given enough of a chance to compete. Which only proves that if he was given a chance to other stuff outside of the throwing the ball in the first place, his team would have won. The fact that Harold couldn't throw the ball didn't make him bad at dodgeball, it just made him bad at throwing.

    And no Harold did not do that to himself. Courtney grabbed his arm and made it quite clear that his arms weren't strong enough to push the canoes in "Up The Creek" when all she could have said was that they were looking for someone strong to push the canoes and keep Harold's strength out of it. She didn't have to humiliate him in front of his entire team.

    BrainMan820 wrote:
    And tampering with the votes still makes no sense. By your logic, Duncan would have probably tormented or hurt Harold if Harold cheated off Duncan, and Duncan found out. Well, what makes Harold think things would be any different if he cheats off Duncan's girlfriend? What, does he think Duncan is just going to let it slide? Or that Courtney wouldn't seek her own revenge?

    It works the other way around, too. If Harold would have cheated out Duncan instead of Courtney, Courtney would have penalized Harold for trying to cheat off her boyfriend.

    You keep saying that my logic makes no sense. You're saying that it's alright for Harold to be picked on, just because he was trying to make Duncan suffer, when all the while, Duncan was trying to make Harold suffer from the beginning.



    He failed extremely in one dodgeball challenged.

    And did good in another one.

    You have NO evidence saying "If Harold was in more he'd be all that awesome LOL LOL"


    Are you reading the same thing I'm reading? Because I don't remember ever seeing the words "If Harold was in more he'd be all that awesome LOL LOL" in imverybasic's post.
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  • Avatar of imverybasic

    imverybasic

    [407]Oct 10, 2009
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    Exactly.

    Diddy_2000 wrote:
    He failed extremely in one dodgeball challenged. And did good in another one. You have NO evidence saying "If Harold was in more he'd be all that awesome LOL LOL"

    The fact that you fail to see Harold's dodging skills is hilarious.

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  • Avatar of alagaesian

    alagaesian

    [408]Oct 10, 2009
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    By the way everyone, I think that Harold SHOULD have cheated Duncan off instead of Courtney, as the resident delinquent was the one to bully him. Courtney is actually not that bad morally in TDI. At least, compared to Duncan.

    However, considering that she handled the situation by MAULING HIM WITH A LAMPPOST, and that Duncan STILL hasn't given Harold a speck of forgiveness or even a break in the pranks so he can catch his breath, I think that any damage Harold has caused has been fully repaid. Duncan needs to grow up a little bit and stop trying to reinforce his alpha-male status.
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  • Avatar of n5d25d90

    n5d25d90

    [409]Oct 10, 2009
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    imverybasic wrote:

    Exactly.

    Diddy_2000 wrote:
    He failed extremely in one dodgeball challenged. And did good in another one. You have NO evidence saying "If Harold was in more he'd be all that awesome LOL LOL"

    The fact that you fail to see Harold's dodging skills is hilarious.



    Actually, I think when he said "And did good in another one" he was still talking about the dodgeball challenge, just a different round.

    If that's not the case though, I agree with you.
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  • Avatar of DarkEyes13

    DarkEyes13

    [410]Oct 10, 2009
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    i actually think its hilarious when duncan picks on harold, it brings so much humor to the show. and i also think harold deserves what he gets... what he did to courtney was hard core. he TOTALLY ruined her chances of winning the 100 grand. and also, wouldnt you want to beat up the person that booted out your love interest? i know i would.
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  • Avatar of Diddy_2000

    Diddy_2000

    [411]Oct 10, 2009
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    Brodoin15 wrote:
    Well, you also do not have any evidence to show he'd totally suck.


    Exactly so NO ONE should give Harold credit in dodgeball.
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  • Avatar of n5d25d90

    n5d25d90

    [412]Oct 10, 2009
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    Diddy_2000 wrote:
    Brodoin15 wrote:
    Well, you also do not have any evidence to show he'd totally suck.


    Exactly so NO ONE should give Harold credit in dodgeball.


    And no one should say he's completely terrible at it either.
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  • Avatar of HaydenAvery

    HaydenAvery

    [413]Oct 11, 2009
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    yes they should! it requires more than throwing to win at dodgeball! courtney was too stuck up to see that! if it werent for geoff being nice and giving him the ball he would never had his rightful chance. then when he got on the court he immediately was insulted by duncan and put in the back. might i remind you that owen was the gophers best player? that he pretty much took out all the bass in that one round? but harold managed to defeat him.
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  • Avatar of Diddy_2000

    Diddy_2000

    [414]Oct 11, 2009
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    n5d25d90 wrote:
    Diddy_2000 wrote:
    Brodoin15 wrote:
    Well, you also do not have any evidence to show he'd totally suck.


    Exactly so NO ONE should give Harold credit in dodgeball.


    And no one should say he's completely terrible at it either.


    no one did
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  • Avatar of n5d25d90

    n5d25d90

    [415]Oct 11, 2009
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    Diddy_2000 wrote:
    n5d25d90 wrote:
    Diddy_2000 wrote:
    Brodoin15 wrote:
    Well, you also do not have any evidence to show he'd totally suck.


    Exactly so NO ONE should give Harold credit in dodgeball.


    And no one should say he's completely terrible at it either.


    no one did


    Courtney pretty much did.
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  • Avatar of animation_luver

    animation_luver

    [416]Oct 11, 2009
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    BrainMan820 wrote:
    animation_luver wrote:
    BrainMan820 wrote:

    Brodoin15 wrote:

    I do like Duncan, but it is pretty much his fault for everything. If he hadn't bullied Harold, nothing would have happened. So Duncan is to blame for everything.

    Harold does have some annoying habits, yes, but that didn't give Duncan the right to bully him. He could have told him it bothered him, or something.

    Duncan's bullying does not excuse Harold in the slightest, merely because it was ultimately a conscious decision made by Harold out of spite. Harold is ultimately responsible for his own actions: he is the one who made them.

    Simple logic disctates that Harold is responsible for his own actions. Duncan and his pranks are irrelevant because Harold cheated off Courtney, not him. He just wanted Duncan to suffer. There is no excuse for such an act done purely of malice. Say what you will of Courtney's harshness, she was willing to help Harold out (giving him the strategy to win in dodgeball, and actually letting him go in the talent contest. Please recall that Geoff, DJ, and Courtney all had excellent talents lined up. A little harsh, yes, but not malevolent.)

    Harold, by contrast, doesn't have anything to balance out his cheating. He's willing to work with the team for the challenges, but we rarely, if ever, see kindness out of him.

    are you serious like really? duncan tricked him into eating underwear snadwiches and he put hot sauce in the underwear he wore. they stole his clothes and he went naked running around camp and you say his pranks are irrelevant? id say they are pretty relevant seeing as how they led to courtneys eliminaton. besides chris knew what harold did and instead of eliminating harold for cheating the let it slide for drama. but when it coems down to it, dncan picked on harold alot and thats what caused this whole mess. obviously nobodys ever bothered you to the point where you want to do something crazy because you arent making much sense

    You...didn't read a word that was written, did you? Harold consciously cheated off Courtney to spite Duncan. The fact that he cheated off Courtney is the clincher, because Courtney was not responsible for anything Harold was being pranked with. In fact, Courtney seemed pretty pissed off about it during the cooking challenge. Goes to show what an "amazing person" Harold is.

    ok i understand where youre coming from but look at it this way: duncan and the othjer guys were making him suffer and eliminating duncan would be too easy for harold so instead he eliminated courtney to make him suffer. i agree it wasnt fair for courtney but he was angry and distressed and people usually dont think straight when they feel thatway. he obviously regrets it and is sorry for what he did buit duncan being the loser he is just wont let go of the past despite the fact that courtney is back in the game plus she has her lawyers to back her up this time so eve if harold pulled sone crap liek that again her lawyers wouldnt have any of it. so honestly they just need to grow up and let go of the past.
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  • Avatar of animation_luver

    animation_luver

    [417]Oct 11, 2009
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    and to the people saying harold deserves what he gets because he cheated courtney of 100,000 and took away duncans love ineterest look, now she has a chance at 1 million and they are back together again so the arguement is invalid. they should actually be grateful to harold because if he never cheated her out the challenge she wouldnt have an excuse to come back unless they brought her back for mere drama.
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  • Avatar of DarkEyes13

    DarkEyes13

    [418]Oct 11, 2009
    • member since: 05/23/09
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    animation_luver wrote:
    and to the people saying harold deserves what he gets because he cheated courtney of 100,000 and took away duncans love ineterest look, now she has a chance at 1 million and they are back together again so the arguement is invalid. they should actually be grateful to harold because if he never cheated her out the challenge she wouldnt have an excuse to come back unless they brought her back for mere drama.

    now that i think on it....i agree; she wouldnt have gotten the chance to get the one million if it werent for harold booting her out of last season.

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  • Avatar of BrainMan820

    BrainMan820

    [419]Oct 11, 2009
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    imverybasic wrote:

    BrainMan820 wrote:
    It's quite obvious that Harold was bad at dodgeball: Leshawna threw him out with absolutely no effort, and his attempt at a throw was absolutely pathetic. It makes perfect sense given Harold's complete lack of "wicked skills." She also didn't showcase his bad arm to the entire team: Harold did that himself. If Courtney had "given Harold a chance" they would have lost.

    This is completely un-true. Harold ended up taking the victory for his team. He showed that he was able to both dodge and catch the balls thrown directly at him. If anyone tries to respond with "Harold only got one person out", it's only because he wasn't given enough of a chance to compete. Which only proves that if he was given a chance to other stuff outside of the throwing the ball in the first place, his team would have won. The fact that Harold couldn't throw the ball didn't make him bad at dodgeball, it just made him bad at throwing.

    And no Harold did not do that to himself. Courtney grabbed his arm and made it quite clear that his arms weren't strong enough to push the canoes in "Up The Creek" when all she could have said was that they were looking for someone strong to push the canoes and keep Harold's strength out of it. She didn't have to humiliate him in front of his entire team.

    BrainMan820 wrote:
    And tampering with the votes still makes no sense. By your logic, Duncan would have probably tormented or hurt Harold if Harold cheated off Duncan, and Duncan found out. Well, what makes Harold think things would be any different if he cheats off Duncan's girlfriend? What, does he think Duncan is just going to let it slide? Or that Courtney wouldn't seek her own revenge?

    It works the other way around, too. If Harold would have cheated out Duncan instead of Courtney, Courtney would have penalized Harold for trying to cheat off her boyfriend.

    You keep saying that my logic makes no sense. You're saying that it's alright for Harold to be picked on, just because he was trying to make Duncan suffer, when all the while, Duncan was trying to make Harold suffer from the beginning.

    Harold is shown to be bad in dodgeball: Leshawna threw him out with no effort, and she wasn't half the player Owen was. He wasn't some effortless dodger. In fact, I'm quite willing to bet it was more Owen's fault than anything, as he threw many balls concurrently. This is only my hypothesis, but the fact that Leshawna did in fact throw Harold out is a damper on his skills.

    And as for the other part, please remember that the game is dodgeball. There is nothing to do other then throw the ball and catch the ball. Leshawna proved that Harold wasn't skilled at either of them. He was able to catch only when he focused on the task (with prodding from Courtney)

    As for the voting, I agree. I actually don't mind that Harold pranked Duncan in retaliation. What matters is what he did to do it: He cheated off Courtney. She was the one affected by this, and Harold had no right to take revenge against her. Thus, she is within her rights to torment him, and Duncan, who also suffered, has a right to bully Harold for cheating off his girlfriend.

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  • Avatar of BrainMan820

    BrainMan820

    [420]Oct 11, 2009
    • member since: 12/10/04
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    HaydenAvery wrote:
    yes they should! it requires more than throwing to win at dodgeball! courtney was too stuck up to see that! if it werent for geoff being nice and giving him the ball he would never had his rightful chance. then when he got on the court he immediately was insulted by duncan and put in the back. might i remind you that owen was the gophers best player? that he pretty much took out all the bass in that one round? but harold managed to defeat him.

    Except Harold showed that he couldn't catch, either. He ran away screaming as the ball came near him, and neither caught it nor dodged.

    Recall that half the players Owen threw out (Bridgette and Sadie) were not overly coordinated. Throwing them out required no effort.

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