We're moving Forums to the Community pages. Click here for more information and updates.

Avatar: The Last Airbender Forums

Nickelodeon (ended 2008)

Katara vs Zuko

  • Avatar of misterham

    misterham

    [41]Oct 5, 2006
    • member since: 10/02/06
    • level: 4
    • rank: Thighmaster
    • posts: 600
    well after rewatching the fight between them, katars WAS actually caught off guard. she had just turned around when zuko unleashed (what looked like) a fireball that took a great amount of effort. Katara had only the amount of time to put up a weak water shield which wasn't enough for the fireball. then she got knocked out.

    also, we need to consider that both characters have gotten better at bending, though I would say Katara improved more since Zuko couldn't use it for a period of time or he would be caught
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of pmgandrews

    pmgandrews

    [42]Oct 6, 2006
    • member since: 01/03/05
    • level: 3
    • rank: Soup Nazi
    • posts: 35
    misterham wrote:
    well after rewatching the fight between them, katars WAS actually caught off guard. she had just turned around when zuko unleashed (what looked like) a fireball that took a great amount of effort. Katara had only the amount of time to put up a weak water shield which wasn't enough for the fireball. then she got knocked out. also, we need to consider that both characters have gotten better at bending, though I would say Katara improved more since Zuko couldn't use it for a period of time or he would be caught
    But thats neglecting the fact that Katara's stregnth was increased due to the moon. Meaning Zuko was equal to Katara on Mooneroids, not regular Katara.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of AKAE124Ultima

    AKAE124Ultima

    [43]Oct 6, 2006
    • member since: 06/18/06
    • level: 3
    • rank: Soup Nazi
    • posts: 277
    I think that they are equally matched, but the enviroment boosts one of them (water, moon/sun, familiar enviroments).
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of jinson_cme

    jinson_cme

    [44]Oct 6, 2006
    • member since: 06/13/06
    • level: 4
    • rank: Thighmaster
    • posts: 18
    Zuko would have owned the little girl had he improved upon his techniques. It seems firebenders only have the thrust of fire, no real use of control in battle. Anyway, Zuko is definitely more powerful.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of masterofaeons

    masterofaeons

    [45]Oct 6, 2006
    • member since: 05/12/04
    • level: 15
    • rank: Ginsu Knife
    • posts: 4,476
    The way I think of this is there are two kind of benders: novice and masters. Of the 4, a firebending novice is the most dangerous because a firebender is all offence. She doesn't gain much more as she continues to master the element. Firebending is a basic program of extending one's form through flares. Through Firebending, you can only be a weapon. However of the masters, a Waterbending Master is the most dangerous adversary because not only is she a weapon and in control of the water surrounding her - but her opponent is also her weapon. Living organisms are mostly water. Much as Magneto could control his prison guard in X2, a Waterbending Master could completely dominate her foe. If one is immobilzed, they cannot Bend.

    The tree has nothing to do with the battle. Neither does the snow. It's just about the advantages of each form and how powerful Katara is at her level. Zuko will always be a tough fighter, fueled by passion and determination, but Katara will eventually be so powerful a Bender, she won't need water.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of arthuroys

    arthuroys

    [46]Oct 6, 2006
    • member since: 10/01/06
    • level: 3
    • rank: Soup Nazi
    • posts: 114
    masterofaeons wrote:
    The way I think of this is there are two kind of benders: novice and masters. Of the 4, a firebending novice is the most dangerous because a firebender is all offence. She doesn't gain much more as she continues to master the element. Firebending is a basic program of extending one's form through flares. Through Firebending, you can only be a weapon. However of the masters, a Waterbending Master is the most dangerous adversary because not only is she a weapon and in control of the water surrounding her - but her opponent is also her weapon. Living organisms are mostly water. Much as Magneto could control his prison guard in X2, a Waterbending Master could completely dominate her foe. If one is immobilzed, they cannot Bend.

    The tree has nothing to do with the battle. Neither does the snow. It's just about the advantages of each form and how powerful Katara is at her level. Zuko will always be a tough fighter, fueled by passion and determination, but Katara will eventually be so powerful a Bender, she won't need water.


    Actually, I'm not so sure a waterbender is more powerful than an earthbender when both have mastered their element.?? It seemed like General Fong completely overpowered Katara in "the avatar state", even though katara was supposed to be a "master" by now/.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of masterofaeons

    masterofaeons

    [47]Oct 6, 2006
    • member since: 05/12/04
    • level: 15
    • rank: Ginsu Knife
    • posts: 4,476
    Katara is by no means a master! She's just good enough to train Aang. The ability to use the water in someone's body against them is a canon idea suggested by the creators (I wish I had the source for that). General Fong is no master either, but he has more fighting experience than Katara. You can't evaluate all Benders of the two elements by those examples. You can only compare Bumi and Pakku - neither of whom have shown what they're fully capable of.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of Herbert0

    Herbert0

    [48]Oct 6, 2006
    • member since: 05/12/05
    • level: 10
    • rank: Holy Level 10!
    • posts: 301

    arthuroys wrote:
    masterofaeons wrote:
    The way I think of this is there are two kind of benders: novice and masters. Of the 4, a firebending novice is the most dangerous because a firebender is all offence. She doesn't gain much more as she continues to master the element. Firebending is a basic program of extending one's form through flares. Through Firebending, you can only be a weapon. However of the masters, a Waterbending Master is the most dangerous adversary because not only is she a weapon and in control of the water surrounding her - but her opponent is also her weapon. Living organisms are mostly water. Much as Magneto could control his prison guard in X2, a Waterbending Master could completely dominate her foe. If one is immobilzed, they cannot Bend. The tree has nothing to do with the battle. Neither does the snow. It's just about the advantages of each form and how powerful Katara is at her level. Zuko will always be a tough fighter, fueled by passion and determination, but Katara will eventually be so powerful a Bender, she won't need water.


    Actually, I'm not so sure a waterbender is more powerful than an earthbender when both have mastered their element.?? It seemed like General Fong completely overpowered Katara in "the avatar state", even though katara was supposed to be a "master" by now/.

    I think match ups also play a role. Like you would not use the strategy against every foe because each of htem think differently.

    for example, a firebender would probably fight more offensively against another firebender but fights more defensivily against an earthbender. Maybe katara probably learned how to fight against a waterbender?? but never learned how to fight against an earthbender.

    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of bishop1fan

    bishop1fan

    [49]Oct 6, 2006
    • member since: 05/15/06
    • level: 2
    • rank: Sweat Hog
    • posts: 79
    when zuko learns electricty bending katara won't stand a chance, she shouldn't stand a chance against azula either, if she does that bs, i'm going to fight your eletricty with my water, if she doesn't get eletricuted if they fight or when i'll be pissed
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of ardron

    ardron

    [50]Oct 6, 2006
    • member since: 08/05/06
    • level: 11
    • rank: Red Shirted Lt.
    • posts: 941
    KATARA DUZ NOT STAND A CHANCE AGANST ZUKO SHES JUST A STUPID LITTLE GIRL HA HA HA IM THE COOLEST HEE HEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of metalcurtainrod

    metalcurtainrod

    [51]Oct 6, 2006
    • member since: 05/15/06
    • level: 10
    • rank: Holy Level 10!
    • posts: 2,302
    I think Zuko would own Katara in a fight. (Big surprise, huh? )
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of LivingdarK

    LivingdarK

    [52]Oct 6, 2006
    • member since: 10/05/06
    • level: 2
    • rank: Sweat Hog
    • posts: 11
    katara needs her mama
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of masterofaeons

    masterofaeons

    [53]Oct 6, 2006
    • member since: 05/12/04
    • level: 15
    • rank: Ginsu Knife
    • posts: 4,476
    Zuko will never learn lightning. He may use it with a few lucky flukes, but Zuko does not have the discipline and control necessary to control the cold blooded fire. Zuko is all passion, which is in fact the opposite of cold-blooded. Zuko is probably the least skilled firebender in the world, but only has figured it out by contant drilling and forcing himself to get it right. This isn't mastering the Futae No Kimemae, you can't get it by doggedness alone. Azula is one of a select few who can master lightning. If Zuko can do it at the drop of a hat, it would cheapen it in everyone's eyes.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of metalcurtainrod

    metalcurtainrod

    [54]Oct 6, 2006
    • member since: 05/15/06
    • level: 10
    • rank: Holy Level 10!
    • posts: 2,302
    masterofaeons wrote:
    Zuko will never learn lightning. He may use it with a few lucky flukes, but Zuko does not have the discipline and control necessary to control the cold blooded fire. Zuko is all passion, which is in fact the opposite of cold-blooded. Zuko is probably the least skilled firebender in the world, but only has figured it out by contant drilling and forcing himself to get it right. This isn't mastering the Futae No Kimemae, you can't get it by doggedness alone. Azula is one of a select few who can master lightning. If Zuko can do it at the drop of a hat, it would cheapen it in everyone's eyes.


    Least skilled?! Are you kidding me? He may not be as good as a lot of the best firebenders in the world(Iroh, Azula, etc.), but that doesn't mean he's the least skilled.

    And you don't need to be cold blooded to do lightning bending. Iroh can do it and we know he isn't like that.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of Hokai

    Hokai

    [55]Oct 6, 2006
    • member since: 06/21/06
    • level: 4
    • rank: Thighmaster
    • posts: 159

    Avatar96321 wrote:
    Bah he only got through her defenses because it was only partly up because he surprised her.The tree did help him cause if u get hit hard anough in the back u will be knocked out.about her being in her terrain he has fire thats not limited by resourses.

    why do you keep saying she was surprised??? before he attacked her he said something, it was night then so she easily froze him. then the sun came up and he broke free and when she tried to blcok he was too strong, because of the sun, so she got knocked back, she was never surprised, just overpowered, the same way zuko was later overpowered

    belive me i've watched it enuf

    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of masterofaeons

    masterofaeons

    [56]Oct 6, 2006
    • member since: 05/12/04
    • level: 15
    • rank: Ginsu Knife
    • posts: 4,476
    Zuko is a failure at everything. He's average at Firebending at best. Zuko's real skills are relentlessness, resourcefulness (see The Blue Spirit) and his purely martial skills (Blue Spirit, Zuko Alone, City of Walls and Secrets). He's a great fighter, but hardly talentled.

    Iroh himself called lightning "The Cold Blooded Fire" (Bitter Work, 2x09) Iroh is not an unemotional person, like Azula, but he is in perfect control of his feelings. Look at how composed he was in 1x20, Siege of the Southern Water Tribe, Part 2. He was angry, but reasonable and exact in his wrath. Iroh can be as pleasant a man as he wishes to be or as fierce as he needs. Zuko doesn't have that control by a long shot.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of metalcurtainrod

    metalcurtainrod

    [57]Oct 6, 2006
    • member since: 05/15/06
    • level: 10
    • rank: Holy Level 10!
    • posts: 2,302
    masterofaeons wrote:
    Zuko is a failure at everything. He's average at Firebending at best. Zuko's real skills are relentlessness, resourcefulness (see The Blue Spirit) and his purely martial skills (Blue Spirit, Zuko Alone, City of Walls and Secrets). He's a great fighter, but hardly talentled.

    Iroh himself called lightning "The Cold Blooded Fire" (Bitter Work, 2x09) Iroh is not an unemotional person, like Azula, but he is in perfect control of his feelings. Look at how composed he was in 1x20, Siege of the Southern Water Tribe, Part 2. He was angry, but reasonable and exact in his wrath. Iroh can be as pleasant a man as he wishes to be or as fierce as he needs. Zuko doesn't have that control by a long shot.


    I'm aware of everything you said in the second paragraph, and yeah you have to be in control of your emotions to lightning bend, but you don't have to be cold blooded.

    Also, Zuko not a talented fighter? He took on like 50 guys in the Blue Spirit! That doesn't take talent?
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of masterofaeons

    masterofaeons

    [58]Oct 6, 2006
    • member since: 05/12/04
    • level: 15
    • rank: Ginsu Knife
    • posts: 4,476
    Cold blooded is a DIRECT QUOTE. Which means it isn't my words, it's canon. You can't argue with what the script has expressedly stated.

    And I'm not saying Zuko isn't a talented fighter. He's an untalented Bender. With everything short of the mystical, Zuko shines. But in the Magical/Bendy world of Avatar where everyone worth a square-punched copper needs to know how to make the elements dance, Zuko is hardly a blip. But that's what makes him an awesome character. He's nothing, yet still moves onward.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of metalcurtainrod

    metalcurtainrod

    [59]Oct 6, 2006
    • member since: 05/15/06
    • level: 10
    • rank: Holy Level 10!
    • posts: 2,302
    masterofaeons wrote:
    Cold blooded is a DIRECT QUOTE. Which means it isn't my words, it's canon. You can't argue with what the script has expressedly stated.


    cold-blooded ???adjective:
    without emotion or feeling; dispassionate; cruel


    Does that sound like Iroh? Yes I am aware of lightning being called the cold-blooded fire. I'm not arguing about that. I'm arguing what you said before about having to be cold-blooded to bend lightning. You have to be in control of your emotions, not cold-blooded.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of masterofaeons

    masterofaeons

    [60]Oct 6, 2006
    • member since: 05/12/04
    • level: 15
    • rank: Ginsu Knife
    • posts: 4,476
    If you are in control of your emotions and you use that to your advantage, you are in fact "without emotion or feeling", hence "cold blooded".

    But the advantage Iroh has is that he can choose to be emotional or not. Think of there being two settings: Zuko and Azula - Passionate and strictly composed. Iroh is the only character on the show that is not a slave to his feelings (Azula not withstanding, as she seems to have no real emotion) and can stand outside of his passion and look at the world unblinded.

    We agree, you're just arguing over semantics.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.