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Nickelodeon (ended 2008)

Analysing Avatar: The Last Airbender

  • Avatar of -TheSecondSign-

    -TheSecondSign-

    [121]Jun 6, 2008
    • member since: 11/03/07
    • level: 8
    • rank: Super-Friend
    • posts: 679

    I don't know if this counts or not, but notice how in the show noone is undefeatable? That a scrawny kid with a boomerang who could plan out predictable trajectory pretty much killed a a seven foot tall man who could make explosions with his mind?

    I've noticed that throughout the show, that everyone could easily beat everyone else. No matter how much power you gather, you are still human. There is no level or tier. You could generate all the power you want, but a person with a bent piece of metal can kill you while he hides behind a wall. Really brings about a "David and Goliath" feel, doesn't it?

    Does that count at all, or was this post stupid and pointless.

    Edited on 06/06/2008 5:06pm
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  • Avatar of MaddoKos

    MaddoKos

    [122]Jun 6, 2008
    • member since: 05/19/08
    • level: 10
    • rank: Holy Level 10!
    • posts: 2,459
    [QUOTE="xRamensx"]
    MaddoKos wrote:
    xRamensx wrote:
    MaddoKos wrote:
    xRamensx wrote:

    MaddoKos wrote:
    tomtitan wrote:
    I think we have to be very careful when analysing literature, because sometimes we look for things that aren't really there. We don't know how many of these so-called metaphors the writers, creators, animators etc. actually intended. With some works of fiction the entire thing is metaphor, Lord of the Flies, for example. With others, some of it is metaphor, Of Mice And Men, for example. With most, none is metaphor, Spongebob, for example. With others, there are a couple of metaphors to keep smart people on their toes, but other than that not much, Avatar, for example.
    I take it your an Intetionalist critic. That is: you try to figure out exactly what the author of a story intended. But there is another line of thought, "Reader response" criticism that holds that a reader's (or viewer's) interpretations are valid regardless of what the author intended.
    xRamensx wrote:
    We know that Azula is genre savvy incarnate. But what about Ursa? We've haven't seen enough of her to make a completel observation...QUOTE] Maybe, but anyone logistically capable of killing Azulon(however she did it) is pretty damn savvy in my book.

    Yeah. I think she's genre savvy, but I had already made a bunch of assumptions, I didn't want to make too many.

    In my eyes, Ursa and Azula are pretty bad*ss. No.. Not pretty. Very.

    But their attitudes are, of course, totally different. Ursa was only did what she did to save Zuko. Azula, meanwhile, has a kind of Lady MacBeth thing going on.

    But Ursa did what she did to protect what she loves.

    Azula does what she does, yes probably for the sheer enjoyment, but also, I think she does it to protect her father. She sort of uses her status to hide a little bit. If she had been of low birth, and still acted like she does now, who knows what would have happened to her.

    But yes, they're overall attitudes are fairly different. But for some reason, I don't see them as completely different. They fight for what is important to them. Azula doesn't actually fight if she doesn't have to. She doesn't rush head-on into a fight, she figures out what what needs to be done and how much force she has to use. If Ursa actually did kill Azulon, then she had been seen (frim what we saw) as an obedient woman who only spoke out if she had to. If Zuko's life, her son's life, was threatened. Then she's going to bite back at whatever the threat is.

    I don't know. I feel like everything Azula does is for Azula. After all, as you pointed out, she lied to Ozai, giving Zuko the credit of killing the Avatar in order to set him up as the fall guy in the event Aang survived. Not the hallmarks of an entirely faithful servent of the crown if you ask me.

    True. Then you can look at it as Azula doing it to protect who she loved; herself.

    But have you noticed that Azula's ways of messing with people depends completely who it is? If it's the Gaang, it's sadistic, if it's Zuko, it's mean, and sometimes pretty cruel, but in "The Beach" when she stepped on and kicked that sandcastle, that was pretty childish. Granted it was a child she was messing with, but I think it's funny how it changes on the situation.

    Azula: Filled with awesome and lulz at the same time.



    Right, but my point is that Ursa's savvy is based on self-sacrifice. Azula's is based on pure egotism.

    Damn it feels good to have an intelligent discussion in here for a change.
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  • Avatar of PsychoPass

    PsychoPass

    [123]Jun 6, 2008
    • member since: 11/05/07
    • level: 11
    • rank: Red Shirted Lt.
    • posts: 2,302
    [QUOTE="MaddoKos"]
    xRamensx wrote:
    MaddoKos wrote:
    xRamensx wrote:

    MaddoKos wrote:
    tomtitan wrote:
    I think we have to be very careful when analysing literature, because sometimes we look for things that aren't really there. We don't know how many of these so-called metaphors the writers, creators, animators etc. actually intended. With some works of fiction the entire thing is metaphor, Lord of the Flies, for example. With others, some of it is metaphor, Of Mice And Men, for example. With most, none is metaphor, Spongebob, for example. With others, there are a couple of metaphors to keep smart people on their toes, but other than that not much, Avatar, for example.
    I take it your an Intetionalist critic. That is: you try to figure out exactly what the author of a story intended. But there is another line of thought, "Reader response" criticism that holds that a reader's (or viewer's) interpretations are valid regardless of what the author intended.
    xRamensx wrote:
    We know that Azula is genre savvy incarnate. But what about Ursa? We've haven't seen enough of her to make a completel observation...QUOTE] Maybe, but anyone logistically capable of killing Azulon(however she did it) is pretty damn savvy in my book.

    Yeah. I think she's genre savvy, but I had already made a bunch of assumptions, I didn't want to make too many.

    In my eyes, Ursa and Azula are pretty bad*ss. No.. Not pretty. Very.

    But their attitudes are, of course, totally different. Ursa was only did what she did to save Zuko. Azula, meanwhile, has a kind of Lady MacBeth thing going on.

    But Ursa did what she did to protect what she loves.

    Azula does what she does, yes probably for the sheer enjoyment, but also, I think she does it to protect her father. She sort of uses her status to hide a little bit. If she had been of low birth, and still acted like she does now, who knows what would have happened to her.

    But yes, they're overall attitudes are fairly different. But for some reason, I don't see them as completely different. They fight for what is important to them. Azula doesn't actually fight if she doesn't have to. She doesn't rush head-on into a fight, she figures out what what needs to be done and how much force she has to use. If Ursa actually did kill Azulon, then she had been seen (frim what we saw) as an obedient woman who only spoke out if she had to. If Zuko's life, her son's life, was threatened. Then she's going to bite back at whatever the threat is.



    I don't know. I feel like everything Azula does is for Azula.

    After all, as you pointed out, she lied to Ozai, giving Zuko the credit of killing the Avatar in order to set him up as the fall guy in the event Aang survived. Not the hallmarks of an entirely faithful servent of the crown if you ask me.


    I'm not sure... That could go two ways: 1). She gave Zuko the credit to protect her pride in the case that the Avatar survived. Or, 2). For the aforementioned reason of setting Zuko up as the "fall guy". The interesting thing is, as pointed out earlier, is that either way, she expected her father to not find out about the truth (she being the one who actually killed Aang).


    I really wonder what her true motive(s) was...
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  • Avatar of xRamensx

    xRamensx

    [124]Jun 6, 2008
    • member since: 03/01/08
    • level: 11
    • rank: Red Shirted Lt.
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    [QUOTE="MaddoKos"]
    xRamensx wrote:
    MaddoKos wrote:
    xRamensx wrote:
    MaddoKos wrote:
    xRamensx wrote:

    MaddoKos wrote:
    tomtitan wrote:
    I think we have to be very careful when analysing literature, because sometimes we look for things that aren't really there. We don't know how many of these so-called metaphors the writers, creators, animators etc. actually intended. With some works of fiction the entire thing is metaphor, Lord of the Flies, for example. With others, some of it is metaphor, Of Mice And Men, for example. With most, none is metaphor, Spongebob, for example. With others, there are a couple of metaphors to keep smart people on their toes, but other than that not much, Avatar, for example.
    I take it your an Intetionalist critic. That is: you try to figure out exactly what the author of a story intended. But there is another line of thought, "Reader response" criticism that holds that a reader's (or viewer's) interpretations are valid regardless of what the author intended.
    xRamensx wrote:
    We know that Azula is genre savvy incarnate. But what about Ursa? We've haven't seen enough of her to make a completel observation...QUOTE] Maybe, but anyone logistically capable of killing Azulon(however she did it) is pretty damn savvy in my book.

    Yeah. I think she's genre savvy, but I had already made a bunch of assumptions, I didn't want to make too many.

    In my eyes, Ursa and Azula are pretty bad*ss. No.. Not pretty. Very.

    But their attitudes are, of course, totally different. Ursa was only did what she did to save Zuko. Azula, meanwhile, has a kind of Lady MacBeth thing going on.

    But Ursa did what she did to protect what she loves.

    Azula does what she does, yes probably for the sheer enjoyment, but also, I think she does it to protect her father. She sort of uses her status to hide a little bit. If she had been of low birth, and still acted like she does now, who knows what would have happened to her.

    But yes, they're overall attitudes are fairly different. But for some reason, I don't see them as completely different. They fight for what is important to them. Azula doesn't actually fight if she doesn't have to. She doesn't rush head-on into a fight, she figures out what what needs to be done and how much force she has to use. If Ursa actually did kill Azulon, then she had been seen (frim what we saw) as an obedient woman who only spoke out if she had to. If Zuko's life, her son's life, was threatened. Then she's going to bite back at whatever the threat is.

    I don't know. I feel like everything Azula does is for Azula. After all, as you pointed out, she lied to Ozai, giving Zuko the credit of killing the Avatar in order to set him up as the fall guy in the event Aang survived. Not the hallmarks of an entirely faithful servent of the crown if you ask me.

    True. Then you can look at it as Azula doing it to protect who she loved; herself.

    But have you noticed that Azula's ways of messing with people depends completely who it is? If it's the Gaang, it's sadistic, if it's Zuko, it's mean, and sometimes pretty cruel, but in "The Beach" when she stepped on and kicked that sandcastle, that was pretty childish. Granted it was a child she was messing with, but I think it's funny how it changes on the situation.

    Azula: Filled with awesome and lulz at the same time.

    Right, but my point is that Ursa's savvy is based on self-sacrifice. Azula's is based on pure egotism. Damn it feels good to have an intelligent discussion in here for a change.

    Yeah, it would be pretty contradictory if Azula was based on self-sacrifice when she's fighting for herself in the first place.

    Inorite? I like screwing around, but I also like having intellectual conversations. It's very.. Freeing? I guess that would be weird saying that the more thought out discussions are more freeing that the random ones, huh? XD

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  • Avatar of MaddoKos

    MaddoKos

    [125]Jun 6, 2008
    • member since: 05/19/08
    • level: 10
    • rank: Holy Level 10!
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    -TheSecondSign- wrote:

    I don't know if this counts or not, but notice how in the show noone is undefeatable? That a scrawny kid with a boomerang who could plan out predictable trajectory pretty much killed a a seven foot tall man who could make explosions with his mind?

    I've noticed that throughout the show, that everyone could easily beat everyone else. No matter how much power you gather, you are still human. There is no level or tier. You could generate all the power you want, but a person with a bent piece of metal can kill you while he hides behind a wall. Really brings about a "David and Goliath" feel, doesn't it?

    Does that count at all, or was this post stupid and pointless.

    No, that was good. I loved the fact that of all people Sokka was the one to take down Combustion Man. But you notice that what really brought Combustion Man down was his inability to concede defeat. Zuko told him he'd pay him extra if he stopped attacking, but at that point it didn't matter because CM was taking it personally. More egotism at work and in CM's case it brought him down.

    Which will probably be Azula's fate as well, considering her supposedly close friends have just betrayed her.

    Edited on 06/06/2008 5:23pm
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  • Avatar of rockon45

    rockon45

    [126]Jun 6, 2008
    • member since: 10/03/07
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    This feels like the Death Note forum. I'll post some deep stuff later.
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  • Avatar of tomtitan

    tomtitan

    [127]Jun 7, 2008
    • member since: 03/01/07
    • level: 19
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    -TheSecondSign- wrote:

    I don't know if this counts or not, but notice how in the show noone is undefeatable? That a scrawny kid with a boomerang who could plan out predictable trajectory pretty much killed a a seven foot tall man who could make explosions with his mind?

    I've noticed that throughout the show, that everyone could easily beat everyone else. No matter how much power you gather, you are still human. There is no level or tier. You could generate all the power you want, but a person with a bent piece of metal can kill you while he hides behind a wall. Really brings about a "David and Goliath" feel, doesn't it?

    Does that count at all, or was this post stupid and pointless.
    Good point. Even kung-fu action Jesus with his kung-fu action Jesus powers activated can be taken down with just a lightning bolt.

    It's the same thing with the elements, no one element is better than the other three, it depends on the bender. If a firebender is more skillful than a waterbender, the firebender will win, if a watebender is more skillful than a firebender, the waterbender will win. The element that they bend doesn't determine their strength, their skill does.
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  • Avatar of yogi_tulsii

    yogi_tulsii

    [128]Jun 7, 2008
    • member since: 08/14/06
    • level: 6
    • rank: Small Wonder
    • posts: 500
    [QUOTE="xRamensx"]
    MaddoKos wrote:
    xRamensx wrote:

    MaddoKos wrote:
    tomtitan wrote:
    I think we have to be very careful when analysing literature, because sometimes we look for things that aren't really there. We don't know how many of these so-called metaphors the writers, creators, animators etc. actually intended. With some works of fiction the entire thing is metaphor, Lord of the Flies, for example. With others, some of it is metaphor, Of Mice And Men, for example. With most, none is metaphor, Spongebob, for example. With others, there are a couple of metaphors to keep smart people on their toes, but other than that not much, Avatar, for example.
    I take it your an Intetionalist critic. That is: you try to figure out exactly what the author of a story intended. But there is another line of thought, "Reader response" criticism that holds that a reader's (or viewer's) interpretations are valid regardless of what the author intended.
    xRamensx wrote:
    We know that Azula is genre savvy incarnate. But what about Ursa? We've haven't seen enough of her to make a completel observation...QUOTE] Maybe, but anyone logistically capable of killing Azulon(however she did it) is pretty damn savvy in my book.

    Yeah. I think she's genre savvy, but I had already made a bunch of assumptions, I didn't want to make too many.

    In my eyes, Ursa and Azula are pretty bad*ss. No.. Not pretty. Very.

    But their attitudes are, of course, totally different. Ursa was only did what she did to save Zuko. Azula, meanwhile, has a kind of Lady MacBeth thing going on.

    But Ursa did what she did to protect what she loves.

    Azula does what she does, yes probably for the sheer enjoyment, but also, I think she does it to protect her father. She sort of uses her status to hide a little bit. If she had been of low birth, and still acted like she does now, who knows what would have happened to her.

    But yes, they're overall attitudes are fairly different. But for some reason, I don't see them as completely different. They fight for what is important to them. Azula doesn't actually fight if she doesn't have to. She doesn't rush head-on into a fight, she figures out what what needs to be done and how much force she has to use. If Ursa actually did kill Azulon, then she had been seen (frim what we saw) as an obedient woman who only spoke out if she had to. If Zuko's life, her son's life, was threatened. Then she's going to bite back at whatever the threat is.

    Yeah who knows what Azula would do if she was born of low birth. Thats something to ponder isnt it! Would she become something like Long Feng? Thats most likely.
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  • Avatar of -TheSecondSign-

    -TheSecondSign-

    [130]Jun 7, 2008
    • member since: 11/03/07
    • level: 8
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    tomtitan wrote:
    -TheSecondSign- wrote:

    I don't know if this counts or not, but notice how in the show noone is undefeatable? That a scrawny kid with a boomerang who could plan out predictable trajectory pretty much killed a a seven foot tall man who could make explosions with his mind?

    I've noticed that throughout the show, that everyone could easily beat everyone else. No matter how much power you gather, you are still human. There is no level or tier. You could generate all the power you want, but a person with a bent piece of metal can kill you while he hides behind a wall. Really brings about a "David and Goliath" feel, doesn't it?

    Does that count at all, or was this post stupid and pointless.
    Good point. Even kung-fu action Jesus with his kung-fu action Jesus powers activated can be taken down with just a lightning bolt. It's the same thing with the elements, no one element is better than the other three, it depends on the bender. If a firebender is more skillful than a waterbender, the firebender will win, if a watebender is more skillful than a firebender, the waterbender will win. The element that they bend doesn't determine their strength, their skill does.

    Well it's not just that. Do you really think Jet would've died if he had been at his full strength when he fought that earthbender? No, he would've kicked his ass.

    That's the whole "everyone is vulnerable" thing. If I came up behind Azula when she was preoccupied and stabbed her in neck, I would win the fight because my enemy is dead. All of the characters have delt out and received their share of "cheap shots", but they aren't really cheap shots. That's how you fight someone.

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  • Avatar of xRamensx

    xRamensx

    [131]Jun 7, 2008
    • member since: 03/01/08
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    • rank: Red Shirted Lt.
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    [QUOTE="yogi_tulsii"]
    xRamensx wrote:
    MaddoKos wrote:
    xRamensx wrote:

    MaddoKos wrote:
    tomtitan wrote:
    I think we have to be very careful when analysing literature, because sometimes we look for things that aren't really there. We don't know how many of these so-called metaphors the writers, creators, animators etc. actually intended. With some works of fiction the entire thing is metaphor, Lord of the Flies, for example. With others, some of it is metaphor, Of Mice And Men, for example. With most, none is metaphor, Spongebob, for example. With others, there are a couple of metaphors to keep smart people on their toes, but other than that not much, Avatar, for example.
    I take it your an Intetionalist critic. That is: you try to figure out exactly what the author of a story intended. But there is another line of thought, "Reader response" criticism that holds that a reader's (or viewer's) interpretations are valid regardless of what the author intended.
    xRamensx wrote:
    We know that Azula is genre savvy incarnate. But what about Ursa? We've haven't seen enough of her to make a completel observation...QUOTE] Maybe, but anyone logistically capable of killing Azulon(however she did it) is pretty damn savvy in my book.

    Yeah. I think she's genre savvy, but I had already made a bunch of assumptions, I didn't want to make too many.

    In my eyes, Ursa and Azula are pretty bad*ss. No.. Not pretty. Very.

    But their attitudes are, of course, totally different. Ursa was only did what she did to save Zuko. Azula, meanwhile, has a kind of Lady MacBeth thing going on.

    But Ursa did what she did to protect what she loves.

    Azula does what she does, yes probably for the sheer enjoyment, but also, I think she does it to protect her father. She sort of uses her status to hide a little bit. If she had been of low birth, and still acted like she does now, who knows what would have happened to her.

    But yes, they're overall attitudes are fairly different. But for some reason, I don't see them as completely different. They fight for what is important to them. Azula doesn't actually fight if she doesn't have to. She doesn't rush head-on into a fight, she figures out what what needs to be done and how much force she has to use. If Ursa actually did kill Azulon, then she had been seen (frim what we saw) as an obedient woman who only spoke out if she had to. If Zuko's life, her son's life, was threatened. Then she's going to bite back at whatever the threat is.

    Yeah who knows what Azula would do if she was born of low birth. Thats something to ponder isnt it! Would she become something like Long Feng? Thats most likely.

    It's hard to say; when she said the divine right to rule is something you're born with, I'm not sure if she meant that your overall status has anything to do with it. Long Feng was conniving, but either the fact that he was born with nothing played a part in his downfall, or Azula was just more intelligent then him.

    I'm going to do with the second one. Azula had planned out Long Feng's moves. She knew, ang hoped, that she would be take to Long Feng (or whoever was in control of the Dai Li) She is a very good actress; even the viewer would forget that she was hoping for this. And when Long Feng was betraying her; she didn't even bat an eye. She saw him as predictable, and in her eyes, predictable does not work in situations like this.

    If Azula had been born like Long Feng, but still had her intelligent, calciulating personality, she probably would have been able to do more that "claw her way" to her goal.

    The way I see it; Azula's mind works like both a chessplayer, and a roadmap. With both, you find different directions you take in case there is an obstacle. You plan on something getting in your way, but don't be surprised by it, find a way around it. She is always several steps ahead of someone and she is rarely surprised.

    But, once and a while, she even slips. What happened with her, Mai and Ty Lee, that was probably the one time something completely off guard. And it will play a big part in her mental deterioration. It's kind of funny that after 14 years of being unnaturally intelligent and physically gifted, being able to get what she wants through manipulation and downright charisma, this one event will be the fray in the thread that will start the unraveling.

    ..That's weird; I'm more insightful when I get very little sleep. :O

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  • Avatar of isabelwhatx

    isabelwhatx

    [132]Jun 7, 2008
    • member since: 11/30/07
    • level: 14
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    MaddoKos wrote:
    -TheSecondSign- wrote:

    I don't know if this counts or not, but notice how in the show noone is undefeatable? That a scrawny kid with a boomerang who could plan out predictable trajectory pretty much killed a a seven foot tall man who could make explosions with his mind?

    I've noticed that throughout the show, that everyone could easily beat everyone else. No matter how much power you gather, you are still human. There is no level or tier. You could generate all the power you want, but a person with a bent piece of metal can kill you while he hides behind a wall. Really brings about a "David and Goliath" feel, doesn't it?

    Does that count at all, or was this post stupid and pointless.

    No, that was good. I loved the fact that of all people Sokka was the one to take down Combustion Man. But you notice that what really brought Combustion Man down was his inability to concede defeat. Zuko told him he'd pay him extra if he stopped attacking, but at that point it didn't matter because CM was taking it personally. More egotism at work and in CM's case it brought him down.

    Which will probably be Azula's fate as well, considering her supposedly close friends have just betrayed her.

    I agree with the Azula comment. Everything that's been happening to her is just foreshadowing her downfall. hopefully *crosses fingers*. Usually, when you're all alone in this show, you fail. CM was alone, and Azula is now alone. Zuko failed because he was alone. I don't count Iroh, even though I love him to death, he wasn't WITH Zuko, he was against what he was doing. Now that Zuko is with the Gaang, he's finally starting to succeed. I think the show is trying to teach the itty bitty 2 year olds something, but they don't know what. ONLY WE KNOW! *cheers*
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  • Avatar of MaddoKos

    MaddoKos

    [133]Jun 7, 2008
    • member since: 05/19/08
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    isabelwhatx wrote:
    MaddoKos wrote:
    -TheSecondSign- wrote:

    I don't know if this counts or not, but notice how in the show noone is undefeatable? That a scrawny kid with a boomerang who could plan out predictable trajectory pretty much killed a a seven foot tall man who could make explosions with his mind?

    I've noticed that throughout the show, that everyone could easily beat everyone else. No matter how much power you gather, you are still human. There is no level or tier. You could generate all the power you want, but a person with a bent piece of metal can kill you while he hides behind a wall. Really brings about a "David and Goliath" feel, doesn't it?

    Does that count at all, or was this post stupid and pointless.

    No, that was good. I loved the fact that of all people Sokka was the one to take down Combustion Man. But you notice that what really brought Combustion Man down was his inability to concede defeat. Zuko told him he'd pay him extra if he stopped attacking, but at that point it didn't matter because CM was taking it personally. More egotism at work and in CM's case it brought him down.

    Which will probably be Azula's fate as well, considering her supposedly close friends have just betrayed her.
    I agree with the Azula comment. Everything that's been happening to her is just foreshadowing her downfall. hopefully *crosses fingers*. Usually, when you're all alone in this show, you fail. CM was alone, and Azula is now alone. Zuko failed because he was alone. I don't count Iroh, even though I love him to death, he wasn't WITH Zuko, he was against what he was doing. Now that Zuko is with the Gaang, he's finally starting to succeed. I think the show is trying to teach the itty bitty 2 year olds something, but they don't know what. ONLY WE KNOW! *cheers*

    And notice in "The Awakening" when Aang tried to go it alone he failed miserably. While we're on the subject of Combustion Man there's something I've been wanting to get off my chest:

    I think CM is based in part on the Hindu god Shiva. There's one myth about Shiva where he blows up Kama, the god of desire, with a heat ray from his third eye. If CM is Shiva then perhaps the close knit comradeship of the Gaang represents Kama (and I mean that in the least pervy way possible).

    Also Shiva is the god of asceticism, and CM is very ascetic in a way - always by himself, never speaking, etc.

    I doubt the writers meant to draw a direct parallel, but did draw inspiration from Shiva.

    Edited on 06/07/2008 10:34am
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  • Avatar of isabelwhatx

    isabelwhatx

    [134]Jun 7, 2008
    • member since: 11/30/07
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    MaddoKos wrote:
    isabelwhatx wrote:
    MaddoKos wrote:
    -TheSecondSign- wrote:

    I don't know if this counts or not, but notice how in the show noone is undefeatable? That a scrawny kid with a boomerang who could plan out predictable trajectory pretty much killed a a seven foot tall man who could make explosions with his mind?

    I've noticed that throughout the show, that everyone could easily beat everyone else. No matter how much power you gather, you are still human. There is no level or tier. You could generate all the power you want, but a person with a bent piece of metal can kill you while he hides behind a wall. Really brings about a "David and Goliath" feel, doesn't it?

    Does that count at all, or was this post stupid and pointless.

    No, that was good. I loved the fact that of all people Sokka was the one to take down Combustion Man. But you notice that what really brought Combustion Man down was his inability to concede defeat. Zuko told him he'd pay him extra if he stopped attacking, but at that point it didn't matter because CM was taking it personally. More egotism at work and in CM's case it brought him down.

    Which will probably be Azula's fate as well, considering her supposedly close friends have just betrayed her.

    I agree with the Azula comment. Everything that's been happening to her is just foreshadowing her downfall. hopefully *crosses fingers*. Usually, when you're all alone in this show, you fail. CM was alone, and Azula is now alone. Zuko failed because he was alone. I don't count Iroh, even though I love him to death, he wasn't WITH Zuko, he was against what he was doing. Now that Zuko is with the Gaang, he's finally starting to succeed. I think the show is trying to teach the itty bitty 2 year olds something, but they don't know what. ONLY WE KNOW! *cheers*


    And notice in "The Awakening" when Aang tried to go it alone he failed miserably.

    While we're on the subject of Combustion Man there's something I've been wanting to get off my chest:

    I think CM is base in part on the Hindu god Shiva. There's one myth about Shiva where he blows up Kama, the god of desire, with a heat ray from his third eye.

    If CM is Shiva then perhaps the close knit comradeship of the Gaang represents Kama (and I mean that in the least pervy way possible).

    Also Shiva is the god of asceticism, and CM is very ascetic in a way - always by himself, never speaking, etc.

    Those are good ALLUSIONS! *channels english teacher*. But, seriously, I agree with that completely. I mean, I don't think CM was just randomely plopped in there for a reason. He only lasted for a few episodes. They could've done something less dramatic to show that Zuko knew he was alive, you know? It's got to be significant in some way, and I think that might've been part of it.
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  • Avatar of MaddoKos

    MaddoKos

    [135]Jun 7, 2008
    • member since: 05/19/08
    • level: 10
    • rank: Holy Level 10!
    • posts: 2,459
    isabelwhatx wrote:
    MaddoKos wrote:
    isabelwhatx wrote:
    MaddoKos wrote:
    -TheSecondSign- wrote:

    I don't know if this counts or not, but notice how in the show noone is undefeatable? That a scrawny kid with a boomerang who could plan out predictable trajectory pretty much killed a a seven foot tall man who could make explosions with his mind?

    I've noticed that throughout the show, that everyone could easily beat everyone else. No matter how much power you gather, you are still human. There is no level or tier. You could generate all the power you want, but a person with a bent piece of metal can kill you while he hides behind a wall. Really brings about a "David and Goliath" feel, doesn't it?

    Does that count at all, or was this post stupid and pointless.

    No, that was good. I loved the fact that of all people Sokka was the one to take down Combustion Man. But you notice that what really brought Combustion Man down was his inability to concede defeat. Zuko told him he'd pay him extra if he stopped attacking, but at that point it didn't matter because CM was taking it personally. More egotism at work and in CM's case it brought him down.

    Which will probably be Azula's fate as well, considering her supposedly close friends have just betrayed her.
    I agree with the Azula comment. Everything that's been happening to her is just foreshadowing her downfall. hopefully *crosses fingers*. Usually, when you're all alone in this show, you fail. CM was alone, and Azula is now alone. Zuko failed because he was alone. I don't count Iroh, even though I love him to death, he wasn't WITH Zuko, he was against what he was doing. Now that Zuko is with the Gaang, he's finally starting to succeed. I think the show is trying to teach the itty bitty 2 year olds something, but they don't know what. ONLY WE KNOW! *cheers*
    And notice in "The Awakening" when Aang tried to go it alone he failed miserably. While we're on the subject of Combustion Man there's something I've been wanting to get off my chest: I think CM is base in part on the Hindu god Shiva. There's one myth about Shiva where he blows up Kama, the god of desire, with a heat ray from his third eye. If CM is Shiva then perhaps the close knit comradeship of the Gaang represents Kama (and I mean that in the least pervy way possible). Also Shiva is the god of asceticism, and CM is very ascetic in a way - always by himself, never speaking, etc.
    Those are good ALLUSIONS! *channels english teacher*. But, seriously, I agree with that completely.

    Thanx! I was worried I was pushing a little far there.

    Edited on 06/07/2008 11:02am
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  • Avatar of isabelwhatx

    isabelwhatx

    [136]Jun 7, 2008
    • member since: 11/30/07
    • level: 14
    • rank: Autobot
    • posts: 6,106
    MaddoKos wrote:
    isabelwhatx wrote:
    MaddoKos wrote:
    isabelwhatx wrote:
    MaddoKos wrote:
    -TheSecondSign- wrote:

    I don't know if this counts or not, but notice how in the show noone is undefeatable? That a scrawny kid with a boomerang who could plan out predictable trajectory pretty much killed a a seven foot tall man who could make explosions with his mind?

    I've noticed that throughout the show, that everyone could easily beat everyone else. No matter how much power you gather, you are still human. There is no level or tier. You could generate all the power you want, but a person with a bent piece of metal can kill you while he hides behind a wall. Really brings about a "David and Goliath" feel, doesn't it?

    Does that count at all, or was this post stupid and pointless.

    No, that was good. I loved the fact that of all people Sokka was the one to take down Combustion Man. But you notice that what really brought Combustion Man down was his inability to concede defeat. Zuko told him he'd pay him extra if he stopped attacking, but at that point it didn't matter because CM was taking it personally. More egotism at work and in CM's case it brought him down.

    Which will probably be Azula's fate as well, considering her supposedly close friends have just betrayed her.
    I agree with the Azula comment. Everything that's been happening to her is just foreshadowing her downfall. hopefully *crosses fingers*. Usually, when you're all alone in this show, you fail. CM was alone, and Azula is now alone. Zuko failed because he was alone. I don't count Iroh, even though I love him to death, he wasn't WITH Zuko, he was against what he was doing. Now that Zuko is with the Gaang, he's finally starting to succeed. I think the show is trying to teach the itty bitty 2 year olds something, but they don't know what. ONLY WE KNOW! *cheers*
    And notice in "The Awakening" when Aang tried to go it alone he failed miserably. While we're on the subject of Combustion Man there's something I've been wanting to get off my chest: I think CM is base in part on the Hindu god Shiva. There's one myth about Shiva where he blows up Kama, the god of desire, with a heat ray from his third eye. If CM is Shiva then perhaps the close knit comradeship of the Gaang represents Kama (and I mean that in the least pervy way possible). Also Shiva is the god of asceticism, and CM is very ascetic in a way - always by himself, never speaking, etc.
    Those are good ALLUSIONS! *channels english teacher*. But, seriously, I agree with that completely.

    Thanx! I was worried I was pushing a little far there.


    Ahahaa, it makes sense. Also, there was a forum about Aang having parallels to Jesus. Whether you believe in him or not, you can't deny it. I think Aangs going to die in the end. AND NOT COME BACK LIKE F**KING HARRY POTTER. Ahahaha. That pissed me off. Sorry, off topic =]
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  • Avatar of tomtitan

    tomtitan

    [137]Jun 7, 2008
    • member since: 03/01/07
    • level: 19
    • rank: Fall Guy
    • posts: 10,891
    isabelwhatx wrote:
    MaddoKos wrote:
    isabelwhatx wrote:
    MaddoKos wrote:
    isabelwhatx wrote:
    MaddoKos wrote:
    -TheSecondSign- wrote:

    I don't know if this counts or not, but notice how in the show noone is undefeatable? That a scrawny kid with a boomerang who could plan out predictable trajectory pretty much killed a a seven foot tall man who could make explosions with his mind?

    I've noticed that throughout the show, that everyone could easily beat everyone else. No matter how much power you gather, you are still human. There is no level or tier. You could generate all the power you want, but a person with a bent piece of metal can kill you while he hides behind a wall. Really brings about a "David and Goliath" feel, doesn't it?

    Does that count at all, or was this post stupid and pointless.

    No, that was good. I loved the fact that of all people Sokka was the one to take down Combustion Man. But you notice that what really brought Combustion Man down was his inability to concede defeat. Zuko told him he'd pay him extra if he stopped attacking, but at that point it didn't matter because CM was taking it personally. More egotism at work and in CM's case it brought him down.

    Which will probably be Azula's fate as well, considering her supposedly close friends have just betrayed her.
    I agree with the Azula comment. Everything that's been happening to her is just foreshadowing her downfall. hopefully *crosses fingers*. Usually, when you're all alone in this show, you fail. CM was alone, and Azula is now alone. Zuko failed because he was alone. I don't count Iroh, even though I love him to death, he wasn't WITH Zuko, he was against what he was doing. Now that Zuko is with the Gaang, he's finally starting to succeed. I think the show is trying to teach the itty bitty 2 year olds something, but they don't know what. ONLY WE KNOW! *cheers*
    And notice in "The Awakening" when Aang tried to go it alone he failed miserably. While we're on the subject of Combustion Man there's something I've been wanting to get off my chest: I think CM is base in part on the Hindu god Shiva. There's one myth about Shiva where he blows up Kama, the god of desire, with a heat ray from his third eye. If CM is Shiva then perhaps the close knit comradeship of the Gaang represents Kama (and I mean that in the least pervy way possible). Also Shiva is the god of asceticism, and CM is very ascetic in a way - always by himself, never speaking, etc.
    Those are good ALLUSIONS! *channels english teacher*. But, seriously, I agree with that completely.

    Thanx! I was worried I was pushing a little far there.


    Ahahaa, it makes sense. Also, there was a forum about Aang having parallels to Jesus. Whether you believe in him or not, you can't deny it. I think Aangs going to die in the end. AND NOT COME BACK LIKE F**KING HARRY POTTER. Ahahaha. That pissed me off. Sorry, off topic =]
    Yeah I remember that third eye story. Shiva made a third eye on his forehead because someone covered his two regular eyes. Nicely spotted.

    And yes, Aang=Jesus. Not as much as Aslan=Jesus, but Aang still=Jesus
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  • Avatar of MaddoKos

    MaddoKos

    [138]Jun 7, 2008
    • member since: 05/19/08
    • level: 10
    • rank: Holy Level 10!
    • posts: 2,459
    tomtitan wrote:
    isabelwhatx wrote:
    MaddoKos wrote:
    isabelwhatx wrote:
    MaddoKos wrote:
    isabelwhatx wrote:
    MaddoKos wrote:
    -TheSecondSign- wrote:

    I don't know if this counts or not, but notice how in the show noone is undefeatable? That a scrawny kid with a boomerang who could plan out predictable trajectory pretty much killed a a seven foot tall man who could make explosions with his mind?

    I've noticed that throughout the show, that everyone could easily beat everyone else. No matter how much power you gather, you are still human. There is no level or tier. You could generate all the power you want, but a person with a bent piece of metal can kill you while he hides behind a wall. Really brings about a "David and Goliath" feel, doesn't it?

    Does that count at all, or was this post stupid and pointless.

    No, that was good. I loved the fact that of all people Sokka was the one to take down Combustion Man. But you notice that what really brought Combustion Man down was his inability to concede defeat. Zuko told him he'd pay him extra if he stopped attacking, but at that point it didn't matter because CM was taking it personally. More egotism at work and in CM's case it brought him down.

    Which will probably be Azula's fate as well, considering her supposedly close friends have just betrayed her.
    I agree with the Azula comment. Everything that's been happening to her is just foreshadowing her downfall. hopefully *crosses fingers*. Usually, when you're all alone in this show, you fail. CM was alone, and Azula is now alone. Zuko failed because he was alone. I don't count Iroh, even though I love him to death, he wasn't WITH Zuko, he was against what he was doing. Now that Zuko is with the Gaang, he's finally starting to succeed. I think the show is trying to teach the itty bitty 2 year olds something, but they don't know what. ONLY WE KNOW! *cheers*
    And notice in "The Awakening" when Aang tried to go it alone he failed miserably. While we're on the subject of Combustion Man there's something I've been wanting to get off my chest: I think CM is base in part on the Hindu god Shiva. There's one myth about Shiva where he blows up Kama, the god of desire, with a heat ray from his third eye. If CM is Shiva then perhaps the close knit comradeship of the Gaang represents Kama (and I mean that in the least pervy way possible). Also Shiva is the god of asceticism, and CM is very ascetic in a way - always by himself, never speaking, etc.
    Those are good ALLUSIONS! *channels english teacher*. But, seriously, I agree with that completely.

    Thanx! I was worried I was pushing a little far there.


    Ahahaa, it makes sense. Also, there was a forum about Aang having parallels to Jesus. Whether you believe in him or not, you can't deny it. I think Aangs going to die in the end. AND NOT COME BACK LIKE F**KING HARRY POTTER. Ahahaha. That pissed me off. Sorry, off topic =]
    Yeah I remember that third eye story. Shiva made a third eye on his forehead because someone covered his two regular eyes. Nicely spotted.

    And yes, Aang=Jesus. Not as much as Aslan=Jesus, but Aang still=Jesus


    Does Aang=Jesus as much as Neo=Jesus?
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  • Avatar of DeeDuck33

    DeeDuck33

    [139]Jun 7, 2008
    • member since: 04/15/08
    • level: 11
    • rank: Red Shirted Lt.
    • posts: 1,198
    You can never really hate a character on the show. Everyone has this trait that attracts you. You may not like the overall personality but someone's determination or trustworthiness is what keeps you from completely hating them. Notice how in almost every other television show, there is that one guy that is potrayed as the definiton of evil and it never goes any deeper than that. In Avatar, not one person is all good, no one is all bad (even Ozai has a likeable trait -- cunning; and I don't actually hate Haru, I'm just annoyed with his presence). I don't think any one person is the carnate of evil... they're choices just so happen to hurt others. There is no one line between good and evil, in Avatar, it all depends on perspective. Ozai probably thinks he is doing the right thing. I doubt he does what he does solely for kicks (though he probably does enjoy torturing people).

    Sure, there are viewers who run around saying such and such should die, but they only look at the show at face value.
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  • Avatar of -TheSecondSign-

    -TheSecondSign-

    [140]Jun 7, 2008
    • member since: 11/03/07
    • level: 8
    • rank: Super-Friend
    • posts: 679

    I have to say I gotta give props to Azula for her ability to manipulate people.

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