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Nickelodeon (ended 2008)

UPDATE 5/3/06: Dark Avatar Theory v5.5

  • Avatar of animekitsune

    animekitsune

    [61]Jun 20, 2006
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    Yeah Zhao was all "whoa... I'm dead." right then so I guess he figured "meh, not like I'm gonna loose anythign anyway..." then BOOM and bye bye to the pretty fishy
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  • Avatar of Gantros

    Gantros

    [62]Jun 20, 2006
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    Colonel_Brian wrote:
    Eman5805 wrote:

    ??I was watching the season 1 finale about the ocean and moon spirits and it got me thinking. What about the other spirits? Could there be a fire spirit? Could the DA have tainted the fire spirit enough to start the war? Something motivated Zhao to kill the moon spirit...and perhaps the fire spirit(working under the DA's influence) gave Zhao the rush of rage to kill it. Cuz I also noticed how shocked Zhao looked after doing it...but perhaps that wasn't shock but rather fear of what Iroh or Ang would do to him...but anyway just tossing my idea out n seeing how it goes over...

    Not really Zhao lacked self control and yes he feared what Iroh and Aang would do to him.



    I actually considered that it was the patron spirits of all four nations that sealed the Dark Avatar Spirit in the Comet. So, the pursuit of the death of Spirits was an act of revenge. Zhao was influenced by delusions of grandeur and when he hesitated the DA basically sent a silent "DO IT NOW!" to kill the Moon Spirit.
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  • Avatar of qweasdzse

    qweasdzse

    [63]Jun 20, 2006
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    How would Shadow bending control darkness I would think it woul only control shadows. Shadow and darkness are different darkness is absent of light shadows are made by light. Ravens abilities aren't shadow there just magic hence the magic words there should not be any magic Avatar. Shadow bending should be?? like Kagemane no justu from the Nara family in Naruto. Bisicaly your shadow attaches to someone else to control them the same way your shadow usually moves along with you. Also light bending is a bit ridicuous idea that wouldn't do anything to anyone other then shadow benders and to them it only nullifies the attack.
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  • Avatar of Eman5805

    Eman5805

    [64]Jun 20, 2006
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    the simplest way to put all the bending disciplines is...

    Airbenders: Evade the attack.

    Waterbenders: Move with the attack.

    Earthbenders: Meet the attack head on.

    Firebenders: Attack fast before the opponent can.

    so where would shadow and lightbending fall? seems that Lightbending: Stop the attack and Shadowbending: Control or??the attack

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  • Avatar of Gantros

    Gantros

    [65]Jun 20, 2006
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    qweasdzse wrote:
    How would Shadow bending control darkness I would think it woul only control shadows. Shadow and darkness are different darkness is absent of light shadows are made by light. Ravens abilities aren't shadow there just magic hence the magic words there should not be any magic Avatar. Shadow bending should be?? like Kagemane no justu from the Nara family in Naruto. Bisicaly your shadow attaches to someone else to control them the same way your shadow usually moves along with you. Also light bending is a bit ridicuous idea that wouldn't do anything to anyone other then shadow benders and to them it only nullifies the attack.


    The physical attacks are shadows, flat objects that can slice, entagle or shield, as well as limited invisibility and illusion tactics. The "darkness" is the manipulation of Yin in people, influencing them to act in negative or "dark" ways.
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  • Avatar of cloudstrifeff7

    cloudstrifeff7

    [66]Jun 21, 2006
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    Gantros wrote:
    qweasdzse wrote:
    How would Shadow bending control darkness I would think it woul only control shadows. Shadow and darkness are different darkness is absent of light shadows are made by light. Ravens abilities aren't shadow there just magic hence the magic words there should not be any magic Avatar. Shadow bending should be like Kagemane no justu from the Nara family in Naruto. Bisicaly your shadow attaches to someone else to control them the same way your shadow usually moves along with you. Also light bending is a bit ridicuous idea that wouldn't do anything to anyone other then shadow benders and to them it only nullifies the attack.


    The physical attacks are shadows, flat objects that can slice, entagle or shield, as well as limited invisibility and illusion tactics. The "darkness" is the manipulation of Yin in people, influencing them to act in negative or "dark" ways.


    so bassically shadow benders can control and manipulate people thoughts and actions ? sorta making then bad-ass indestructable super-benders ?
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  • Avatar of Gantros

    Gantros

    [67]Jun 21, 2006
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    cloudstrifeff7 wrote:
    Gantros wrote:
    qweasdzse wrote:
    How would Shadow bending control darkness I would think it woul only control shadows. Shadow and darkness are different darkness is absent of light shadows are made by light. Ravens abilities aren't shadow there just magic hence the magic words there should not be any magic Avatar. Shadow bending should be like Kagemane no justu from the Nara family in Naruto. Bisicaly your shadow attaches to someone else to control them the same way your shadow usually moves along with you. Also light bending is a bit ridicuous idea that wouldn't do anything to anyone other then shadow benders and to them it only nullifies the attack.
    The physical attacks are shadows, flat objects that can slice, entagle or shield, as well as limited invisibility and illusion tactics. The "darkness" is the manipulation of Yin in people, influencing them to act in negative or "dark" ways.
    so bassically shadow benders can control and manipulate people thoughts and actions ? sorta making then bad-ass indestructable super-benders ?

    There is a difference between control and influence. Shadowbenders do not control someone directly, only get them to move in the direction they want, it's no different than convincing someone to do something they otherwise wouldn't do, only they are unaware there's another person involved, they think it's all their idea. Haven't you ever thought something and said to yourself "Where did THAT come from?!", same thing.

    The whole trick of shadow benders is that really they are no powerful than any other nations, it is their strategies (stealth and manipulation of the other nations) and the their "alien" discipline (no one has seen shadowbending for thousands of years, and so it has been lost to time and memory) that make them seem so powerful.

    Shadowbending is like the mugger sticking the finger in his coat pocket in your back, and it's too dark for you to know for sure if it's a gun or not, so you regard him as a threat. The problem is that he also has a knife in that pocket and has convinced your best friend you were going to betray him and so is helping the mugger, who is going to end up robbing both of you. It's the ultimate bluff, divide and conquer, and smoke and mirrors show, but there is also deadly intent, so it's still very dangerous.

    Edited on 06/21/2006 9:05am
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  • Avatar of videogamegeek75

    videogamegeek75

    [68]Jun 21, 2006
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    Shadow Bending can also be powerful in the day. You can control the shadow of a person, thus, controlling the person of the shadow! Lightbending can be used to make illusions in the light, like in Book Two: Chapter Four: The Swamp, where they saw illusions of their lost loved ones, or in the Avatar's case, a future person.
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  • Avatar of Gantros

    Gantros

    [69]Jun 21, 2006
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    [This message was deleted at the request of the original poster]
    Edited on 06/21/2006 5:41pm
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  • Avatar of Gantros

    Gantros

    [70]Jun 21, 2006
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    I just had a breakthrough on shadow and lightbending. They are the same element, just one is the direct manipulation of positive chi, and the other of negative chi. The Dark Avatar is an Avatar who delved too deeply into the negative Chi, and thus became corrupted. So that future generations could not be corrupted, the Spirits intervened and seperated the Avatar's corrupted spirit from the rest of the Avatar Cycle, and sealed it within the Comet, casting it out into the void.
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  • Avatar of legersem

    legersem

    [71]Jun 21, 2006
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    As you know, I am a big fan of this simply because it makes sense to me and it should to Nickelodeon as well. Hopefully this works out for you. However, this is constantly going to have to be updated since the people making the show are going to come out with new ideas and other things to that extent. For example, in your storyline, you would have to explain why the Moon and Ocean Spirits were not in the Spirit World, even though you have said that all of the Spirits helped seal the Dark Avatar in Sozen's Comet, after they helped out. What was their reasoning in staying on Earth and how does this tie in with the Dark Avatar theory? (I was thinking about the whole Ocean and Moon Spirit thing ever since the conversation about Zhao started)
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  • Avatar of Neocrater

    Neocrater

    [72]Jun 22, 2006
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    Bump
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  • Avatar of Gantros

    Gantros

    [73]Jun 23, 2006
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    [This message was deleted at the request of the original poster]
    Edited on 06/23/2006 5:21am
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  • Avatar of Gantros

    Gantros

    [74]Jun 24, 2006
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    [This message was deleted at the request of the original poster]
    Edited on 06/24/2006 5:40pm
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  • Avatar of Neocrater

    Neocrater

    [75]Jun 26, 2006
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    bump

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  • Avatar of Gantros

    Gantros

    [76]Jun 27, 2006
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    OK, I have a new idea on why Shadow and Lightbending shouldn't exist, but do. When the Yin and Yang aspects of the Avatar spirit were whole, the Positive and Negative Chi balanced, and therefore cancelled, each other out, preventing the nearly pure expressions of light and shadowbending to be possible. When the Avatars of Light(currently Aang) and Shadow (the Dark Avatar, currently sealed in Sozen's Comet for millenia) seperated, the bending forms of shadow and light became possible, they are unnatural expressions of bending, and therefore by their existence upset the balance of the 4 natural bending disciplines.
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  • Avatar of JasonG2006

    JasonG2006

    [77]Jun 27, 2006
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    Your theory is amazing Gantros, you seem to have given this alot of thought. I'm damn proud of you, this work is worthy of meeting Mike & Bryan. Of course, people may have many questions about the theory may be capable of fine-tuning and extending it. I can't wait if you come out with new versions, might even create a website for this. I have a question, if the Dark Avatar hasn't returned to restore balance of +/- chi for a milenium, why has all been calm before the fire nation attacked 900+ years later? Why is the Avatar residing in Sozin's Comet, how did it get there, and it this a good thing for the fire nation or a good thing for the world? What is the significance of the unique bending arts, how do they help Yin/Ying coexist peacefully? Why are the Moon & Ocean spirits considered Yin, on the side of the Dark Avatar, what does this make the Sun spirit?

    Truly amazing, I am overwhelmed, you're like my Avatar bud! (Cheers & Applause)

    Edited on 06/27/2006 9:30pm
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  • Avatar of Gantros

    Gantros

    [78]Jun 28, 2006
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    JasonG2006 wrote:

    Your theory is amazing Gantros, you seem to have given this alot of thought. I'm damn proud of you, this work is worthy of meeting Mike & Bryan. Of course, people may have many questions about the theory may be capable of fine-tuning and extending it. I can't wait if you come out with new versions, might even create a website for this. I have a question, if the Dark Avatar hasn't returned to restore balance of +/- chi for a milenium, why has all been calm before the fire nation attacked 900+ years later? Why is the Avatar residing in Sozin's Comet, how did it get there, and it this a good thing for the fire nation or a good thing for the world? What is the significance of the unique bending arts, how do they help Yin/Ying coexist peacefully? Why are the Moon & Ocean spirits considered Yin, on the side of the Dark Avatar, what does this make the Sun spirit?

    Truly amazing, I am overwhelmed, you're like my Avatar bud! (Cheers & Applause)

    I'll try to answer these questions as best I can.

    1.) If the Dark Avatar hasn't returned to restore balance of +/- chi for a milenium, why has all been calm before the fire nation attacked 900+ years later?

    The Dark Avatar Spirit??hasn't been imprisoned for 1000 years, 'millenia' can span many thousands. In this case, it would be very near the Beginning, which may not have necessarily been the first such Beginning. Remember what Roku said to Jeong Jeong (sp?) in 'The Deserter", "I have mastered the elements 1,000 times in 1,000 lifetimes. Now I must do it again. You will teach the Avatar firebending." This could mean that the seperation of??+/- Chi has existed for as long as 100,000 years, if not longer. As for the calm prior to 100 years. I see??a few??possibilities. One is that the orbit of Sozen's Comet was a spiral in an effort to restore the natural balance, and only recently has it been close enough to actually 'bend', thus tampering the seal placed on it and allowing the Dark Avatar to??influence the actions of the Fire Nation NOBILITY, which I differentiate from the common Fire Nation citizen. Second is that it was a stable orbit with a cycle of 100 years, but this creates problems in that if it had such a short cycle, why hadn't this kind of tampering been attempted earlier, the only reason being that the danger was common knowledge until it was lost to the ravages of time. Finally, the third possibilty could be that it was a long cycle, say 1000 years or more, and that when Sozen tampered with it, he altered its orbit into a shorter 100 year cycle.

    2.) Why is the Avatar residing in Sozin's Comet, how did it get there, and it this a good thing for the fire nation or a good thing for the world?

    The DARK Avatar Spirit was imprisoned in the Comet because it represented a threat to all, Spirit and mortal alike. The Spirits did not see any way to undo the damage that had been done, and the Dark Avatar was too dangerous to be permitted to reincarnate, ushering in cycles of chaos and destruction every generation. So, with the aid of the Spirits, even those more inclined to side with negative chi (such as the Ocean Spirit), The Dark Avatar was forcibly removed from the Avatar Cycle, and then sealed in a prison made up of a perfect balance of all four elements, Water and Earth for the core, Air and Fire for the head and tail, which with the skill of the eras greatest benders, was cast from the world into the limitless void. However, like lightning, the negative and positive wishes to restore balance, and come crashing together, so what we are seeing is the first part of a massive train wreck, so it's bad for everyone involved, but in the end, necessary for the world. It's all a matter of whether or not the Four Nations will be alive to see their world in balance again.

    3.) What is the significance of the unique bending arts, how do they help Yin/Ying coexist peacefully?

    Their significance is that they are forms of bending that should not exist. They are pure expressions of +/- Chi, and as such do as much harm to the user, save the Avatars, as they do to others. It's like trying to drink pure soda syrup; without diluting it, it'll kill you as it eats away at your insides with its??caustic nature. If Yin and Yang were to coexist peacefully as they should, they would dilute each other, making such arts impossible to perform. The only reason there are shadowbenders instead of lightbenders is that only the Avatar can give other benders the ability bend pure +/- Chi, and the Avatar of Light (which Aang is) would never teach such a dangerous and ultimately self-destructive art. The Dark Avatar has no such reservations, and would exploit the people foolish enough to seek shadowbending's seductive power to its own ends, which is to cause chaos and destruction, the desire to conquer and rule is given by the incarnation, or after it's release from the Comet, its host.

    4.) Why are the Moon & Ocean spirits considered Yin, on the side of the Dark Avatar, what does this make the Sun spirit?

    The Ocean is Yin, the Moon, Yang. The reason the Ocean would not side with the Dark Avatar is that the Ocean Spirit recognizes the need for Balance, and the Dark Avatar Spirit's only??desire is to upset that Balance. As for the Sun Spirit, very few Fire Nation nobility and military follow it, as they are unwittingly following the will of the Dark Avatar. So, for now, the Sun Spirit has been abandoned by the Fire Nation leadership essentially, save as a military resource. Also, I believe the Spirits??on the whole are in balance with their opposite patron/matron Spirit, and as such cannot show direct expressions of power. I noticed that the Ocean Spirit didn't show it's power until the Moon Spirit had died, upsetting the Balance and unleashing the Ocean's full power, which manifested itself by using Aang as a conduit of sorts. The return of the Moon Spirit caused this power to fade. This is how I believe the fight with the Dark Avatar Spirit will eventually end. I believe the Dark Avatar wishes to rejoin the balance by possessing Aang, but remain dominant over future reincarnations. Aang will eventually realize he must allow this to occur but not dominate or allow to be dominated, restoring true balance, and perhaps removing the need for an Avatar altogether.

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  • Avatar of JasonG2006

    JasonG2006

    [79]Jun 28, 2006
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    I agree with you once the Dark Avatar returns after Sozin's Comet nears the Earth's orbit, the Avatar and Dark Avatar will collide restoring [eternal] balance to the world. After this the need for the Avatar will not be necessary, and the Avatar reincarnation cycle will cease to exist. All those years an Avatar has been around, are the years that Dark Avatar existed in an endless void away from Earth.

    Thanks my questions are answered, possibly other's answers too. You have amazing writing skills, I recommend you should compose Dark Avatar Theory v5.5 from all this new information you have posted.
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  • Avatar of Gantros

    Gantros

    [80]Jun 28, 2006
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    JasonG2006 wrote:
    I agree with you once the Dark Avatar returns after Sozin's Comet nears the Earth's orbit, the Avatar and Dark Avatar will collide restoring [eternal] balance to the world. After this the need for the Avatar will not be necessary, and the Avatar reincarnation cycle will cease to exist. All those years an Avatar has been around, are the years that Dark Avatar existed in an endless void away from Earth.


    I don't think they will simply collide, there just isn't an obvious or natural way to rejoin the +/- sides of the Avatar Spirit. This is where having Azula be the new Dark Avatar comes in. After Aang defeats Ozai, in order to prevent Sozin's Comet from being used again, Aang destroys the comet, and pieces scatter across the world. Most of the fragments dissolve in the atmosphere, but some fall to the ground, but the piece that holds the Dark Avatar Spirit happens to fall near the outskirts of the Fire Nation capitol, where Azula is fleeing into the wilderness (assuming there is any in the Fire Nation). Having lost Agni Kai to Zuko, the result being her lightning was redirected back to her, striking her face and scarring her right eye, she looks bitter and desperate as she goes into the hills. Suddenly, there is a glow above her as a Comet fragment strikes a nearby hillside. She rushes to investagte it and cradles the fragment like a baby, absorbing it's ebbing power. The white glow fades to black, and this blackness begins to move up her arms toward her face. We get a close up of her scarred eye as the black surrounds it, for an iris out to black, and then Azula laughing. End of Season 3.
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