Nickelodeon (ended 2008)
Zuko may have failed at capturing the Avatar, fighting his father, and beating his sister.
But, Zuko does have great potential. In order succede in life you must fail. No matter how many times he may fail he is always ready to get back on his feet.??
Determination, one of the many things I admire in a person and just one of the reasons why Zuko is??my favorite character.
??
OK, here's the Tokien version: *Big sigh from crowd* If you look at what Zuko has tried to accomplish, then yes, he IS a failure, even though he has done some spectacular things. (My favorite: infiltrating the very spiritual center of the Northern Water Tribe by swimming under the entire place in near-freezing water.) He has not captured the Avatar, or even detained him for very long. He has gotten his butt kicked a few times.?? He has utterly failed to impress his father. He has, so far, failed to become a master firebender.
The Tolkien explanation is that Zuko has another, bigger destiny. In LOTR, each character, even the seemingly incompetent ones (Pippin!) had a destiny to fulfill, but sometimes their destinies were quite different from what they had envisioned when they first set out. That's true in a lot of great fantasy stories. Zuko fits into that category. He has failed so far because he's fighting his instincts and his real destiny tooth and nail. We know he thinks his father is up to no good; he said so in episode 3. We know that he kind of likes Aang, and even envies him; he tries not to because he's been trained from birth that the Avatar is his mortal enemy. He's seen first-hand what happens when someone tries to mess with spirits (of which the Avatar is the chief) or the balance of the universe. So, now, he gets to wander around for a while, start to see things through his own eyes instead of those FN-colored glasses, and he'll eventually figure it all out. But it'll be a bumpy ride. Which, of course, is what makes it so interesting.
Just to top off my rambling, here's my favorite poem from The Lord of the Rings:
All that is gold does not glitter,
Not all those who wander are lost;
The old that is strong does not wither,
Deep roots are not reached by the frost.
From the ashes a fire shall be woken,
A light from the shadows shall spring;
Renewed shall be blade that was broken,
The crownless again shall be King.
| mellomuse wrote: |
OK, here's the Tokien version: *Big sigh from crowd* If you look at what Zuko has tried to accomplish, then yes, he IS a failure, even though he has done some spectacular things. (My favorite: infiltrating the very spiritual center of the Northern Water Tribe by swimming under the entire place in near-freezing water.) He has not captured the Avatar, or even detained him for very long. He has gotten his butt kicked a few times.?? He has utterly failed to impress his father. He has, so far, failed to become a master firebender. The Tolkien explanation is that Zuko has another, bigger destiny. In LOTR, each character, even the seemingly incompetent ones (Pippin!) had a destiny to fulfill, but sometimes their destinies were quite different from what they had envisioned when they first set out. That's true in a lot of great fantasy stories. Zuko fits into that category. He has failed so far because he's fighting his instincts and his real destiny tooth and nail. We know he thinks his father is up to no good; he said so in episode 3. We know that he kind of likes Aang, and even envies him; he tries not to because he's been trained from birth that the Avatar is his mortal enemy. He's seen first-hand what happens when someone tries to mess with spirits (of which the Avatar is the chief) or the balance of the universe. So, now, he gets to wander around for a while, start to see things through his own eyes instead of those FN-colored glasses, and he'll eventually figure it all out. But it'll be a bumpy ride. Which, of course, is what makes it so interesting. Just to top off my rambling, here's my favorite poem from The Lord of the Rings: All that is gold does not glitter, Not all those who wander are lost; The old that is strong does not wither, Deep roots are not reached by the frost. From the ashes a fire shall be woken, A light from the shadows shall spring; Renewed shall be blade that was broken, The crownless again shall be King. |
| Herbert0 wrote: |
| Zuko is only a failure to his family. He is royalty, and his sister is a prodigy and aang is like a prodigy also. So you are comparing him practically to the best... You have to compare him to an average bender not the best. |
| someone198 wrote: |
Zuko's a failure at being a villain, that's for sure. But first of all, he *did* defeat Katara earlier that day once the sun came up, and if you use the sun as the only excuse for his strength, you could just as easily attribute Katara's strength only to the moon being full. Second, about the night of "The Blue Spirit," he got into an "impenetrable" fortress- twice- and single-handedly took out four fire benders to get to Aang. Zuko??stood up for a small troop of expendable soldiers, completely unknown to him, valuing human life more than etiquette. He defeated Zhao in an Agni Kai and had the upper hand during their entire fight at the North Pole before the Ocean Spirit interfered. He sprung and took down an armed man with his bare hands in??a??dark alley like Batman. Pretty impressive resume- more impressive than Aang's, I might add, without the Avatar State. Finally, Zuko??showed his arch enemy mercy when he could have killed him ("Southern Air Temple") and tried to save his life ("Siege of the North"), neither of which we know he couldn't expect from Zhao.??That's what I think proves his real strength: despite his upbringing and the atmosphere that surrounded him his entire life and his abuse, he's still himself. The Fire Nation, his sister, and his father have hurt him and beaten him down, but not broken or changed him. I think the fact that *he* cut his hair proves that; he severed his ties with his people of his own free will, which I'm sure hurt, but that requires all the more courage. Now, Zuko definitely thinks of himself as a failure- hates himself for failing his father when he should hate his father for attacking him. Maybe that's weak and crazy, but not at all uncommon. So, Zuko has his strengths and weaknesses- that's what I call "human." |
Alrighty then.
1) The fight with Katara. The moon may empower a waterbender but what matters in the end is skill. Zuko has been training for two years with his uncle one of the greatest firebenders around. While we have someone like Katara who was no more than a few weeks ago couldn't even do a water wipe and after training with Pakku for a day or so was able to beat Zuko....One has to look at it as a simple fact that Zuko isn't a??good bender. He has years of training while Katara has a few days and she was able to beat him.
2) The Fortress...All he had to do is get past the first gate and then he just had to go through sewer areas...Not too hard all he had to do was not get caught sneaking into the wagon.
3) Zhao...Did it ever occur to you that maybe Zhao isn't a good bender? Think about it he has been spending at least the last two years completely involving military activities. Trying to move up in the ranks planning attacks ect... He wouldn't have the free time to train like Zuko did because Zhao had more important things to do in his life then train.
4) The guy Zuko stole the swords from...It wasn't so hard all he did was take them out of his hands and throw him.
5) And let's take a look at Zuko's life before his banishment...We don't know how he was treated, you can only assume. And as for his banishment everything that lead up to that was Zuko's fault not his fathers.
A) He spoke out of turn against a high ranking General when he wasn't even supposed to be in that meeting in the first place.
B)All he had to do was fight his dad in the Agni Kai and he would have never been banished. The worst that would have happened would have been that he would get scared. He'd be hurt but he wouldn't have shown any weakness.
C) Ozai gave Zuko like three chances to fight him and all he did was cry and kneel and this was infront of very high ranking important people. Zuko forced his fathers hand.
And Pool We know that Katara beat those other benders at the north pole but they didn't look all that hard to beat the last guy just sat there as she froze him.
So basically she's better then guys who Pakku even said were terrible.
| mellomuse wrote: |
OK, here's the Tokien version: *Big sigh from crowd* If you look at what Zuko has tried to accomplish, then yes, he IS a failure, even though he has done some spectacular things. (My favorite: infiltrating the very spiritual center of the Northern Water Tribe by swimming under the entire place in near-freezing water.) He has not captured the Avatar, or even detained him for very long. He has gotten his butt kicked a few times.?? He has utterly failed to impress his father. He has, so far, failed to become a master firebender. The Tolkien explanation is that Zuko has another, bigger destiny. In LOTR, each character, even the seemingly incompetent ones (Pippin!) had a destiny to fulfill, but sometimes their destinies were quite different from what they had envisioned when they first set out. That's true in a lot of great fantasy stories. Zuko fits into that category. He has failed so far because he's fighting his instincts and his real destiny tooth and nail. We know he thinks his father is up to no good; he said so in episode 3. We know that he kind of likes Aang, and even envies him; he tries not to because he's been trained from birth that the Avatar is his mortal enemy. He's seen first-hand what happens when someone tries to mess with spirits (of which the Avatar is the chief) or the balance of the universe. So, now, he gets to wander around for a while, start to see things through his own eyes instead of those FN-colored glasses, and he'll eventually figure it all out. But it'll be a bumpy ride. Which, of course, is what makes it so interesting. Just to top off my rambling, here's my favorite poem from The Lord of the Rings: All that is gold does not glitter, Not all those who wander are lost; The old that is strong does not wither, Deep roots are not reached by the frost. From the ashes a fire shall be woken, A light from the shadows shall spring; Renewed shall be blade that was broken, The crownless again shall be King. |
Excuse me, but you're a freaking genius.
| PrinceZukoLover wrote: |
| he is so not a failure he is not a success but no a failuire |
FreakishChild & Someone198:???? *glomp*
*Ahem* ISpeakTheTruth:
You're just jealous because Zuko won Character Elimination 2...
Ha ha, Nanny-nanny boo-boo??
*ducks and runs*
[Seriously, I would be very interested and amused if someone takes a survey to see how many guys think Zuko is a failure??vs. how many girls think Zuko is a failure!]
| mellomuse wrote: |
*Ahem* ISpeakTheTruth: You're just jealous because Zuko won Character Elimination 2... |
No actually I could care less.
| PrinceZukoLover wrote: |
| he is so not a failure he is not a success but no a failure |
| sly4me wrote: |
| this thread must be tough for you. |
| ISpeakTheTruth wrote: | ||
No actually I could care less. |
Zuko is not a failure until he gives up completely. Until then, he just sucks at following through on tasks. But he is driven, once he dos have the avatar (coughyeahrightcough) he won't be considered a failure anymore (coughyeahrightcough)
