Nickelodeon (ended 2008)
| ThisCrazyGuy wrote: |
| I must ask, is a Waterbender capable of creating ice in hot places? In "The Desert", Katara was shown to have no waterbending other than the water in that skin she travels with. But in "The Puppetmaster" Hama, demonstrated the ability to pull ice out of thin air, and I'm assuming it was a hot day there too...? If Pakku is capable of this, then I think the battle could go either way. I think Pakku would win (although one day she will surpass him) in the North and South Poles, but Katara would win else where and under a full moon. I think they are both capable of beating eachother, but in different places and climates. Anyone agree? |
| isabelwhatx wrote: | ||
The desert is very dry. There wasn't much water in the air to pull out. She did use her surroundings by getting the water from the cloud, though. |
| ThisCrazyGuy wrote: |
| I must ask, is a Waterbender capable of creating ice in hot places? In "The Desert", Katara was shown to have no waterbending other than the water in that skin she travels with. But in "The Puppetmaster" Hama, demonstrated the ability to pull ice out of thin air, and I'm assuming it was a hot day there too...? If Pakku is capable of this, then I think the battle could go either way. I think Pakku would win (although one day she will surpass him) in the North and South Poles, but Katara would win else where and under a full moon. I think they are both capable of beating eachother, but in different places and climates. Anyone agree? |
I agree with that. Pakku would win on the North and South Poles, and on sea. But on land, I think Katara has a win. But I think it would be a nice battle though. I assuma that Pakku can also pull water out of thin air, but not as good as Katara. So she will win on dry land. Pakku on Poles and sea.
So here is my ranking:
1,2 Pakku/Katara. It depends on the location who will win. Although it will be a close fight on both locasions.
3 Hama
4 The leader of the swamp benders. He is also very wise. He knows pants are an illusion (btw, in a swamp I think he could defeat Hama)
I can agree 100% with your ranking. Katara/Pakku first (although, I think in the next 10 years when Katara is a young woman, she will be able to surpass him, no matter what the surroundings are), Hama second (creator of Bloodbending, don't really need to explain), and finally, Huu (That's the Swamp guy's name) third (he can control ALL plant-life by the looks of it, even seaweed, and is show to be a pretty wise man).
I know that we stopped arguing about it, but I still wanted to say this. When Iroh burned the firenation flag in Ba Sing Se, 2 giant walls of fire are seen moving, created by Jeong Jeong ofcourse. They where created and moving in one second. So I doubt Azula cand dodge that. I just wanted to say that, I missed that the first time. Please don't get angry
And at the same moment 2 giant waves of water are show moving. So I changed my mind a bit. Pakku can win everywhe if there are some large amounts of water near him. The waves are as quik as the wall of fire, so I doubt Katara can dodge that.
And shall we start now on the Bumi vs Toph part. I think Bumi can win. He is realy MUCH better in regular bending. So in a tradition earthbending match Toph will get her ass kicked. Bumi can move underground and create huge walls of stone, that nearly cant be destroyed. 5 blasts of fire where shot at it during the comet. So that means 5 blasts from 5 firebenders boosted by the comet. And don't forget the bending of nearly the whole city Omashu! And I don't think Toph will be able to trap Bumi or something because he can bend only using his face. Doubt if Toph can do that. And she has the big disatvantage of not being able to see. She can't see flying boulders, so Bumi can knock her off with that. While Bumi can see every attack toph trows at him. And it won't help Toph that she can see with her feet. She might be able to see what Bumi does, but she can't see his attacks.
| TitanPredator wrote: |
| I know that we stopped arguing about it, but I still wanted to say this. When Iroh burned the firenation flag in Ba Sing Se, 2 giant walls of fire are seen moving, created by Jeong Jeong ofcourse. They where created and moving in one second. So I doubt Azula cand dodge that. I just wanted to say that, I missed that the first time. Please don't get angry And at the same moment 2 giant waves of water are show moving. So I changed my mind a bit. Pakku can win everywhe if there are some large amounts of water near him. The waves are as quik as the wall of fire, so I doubt Katara can dodge that. And shall we start now on the Bumi vs Toph part. I think Bumi can win. He is realy MUCH better in regular bending. So in a tradition earthbending match Toph will get her ass kicked. Bumi can move underground and create huge walls of stone, that nearly cant be destroyed. 5 blasts of fire where shot at it during the comet. So that means 5 blasts from 5 firebenders boosted by the comet. And don't forget the bending of nearly the whole city Omashu! And I don't think Toph will be able to trap Bumi or something because he can bend only using his face. Doubt if Toph can do that. And she has the big disatvantage of not being able to see. She can't see flying boulders, so Bumi can knock her off with that. While Bumi can see every attack toph trows at him. And it won't help Toph that she can see with her feet. She might be able to see what Bumi does, but she can't see his attacks. |
If we were going to resume our Azula/Jeong Jeong argument, I'd point out that during the finale Azula creatted a lightning bolt that was so big it almost dwarfed the Fire Nation Capital City. It doesn't matter how fast Jeong Jeong can move, or what defenses he can throw up - he's not going to survive having one of those land anywhere near him. But we've stopped arguing about that, so I'll move on to Bumi/Toph.
You're neglecting the fact that any attack mad by bumi will be sensed by Toph. He can't simply "throw boulders at her" - first he has to rip those boulders out of the ground, which will of course be sensed by Toph, who will know that something is coming. No matter what attack Bumi wants to pull, Toph is going to have some forknowledge of it.
Toph's metalbending may or may not be a factor, depending on where they are fighting.
I will give Bumi props though, for the same reason that I gave them to Azula - his mind. Bumi is a mad genius who knows all 85 jin and who knows what else. It was unclear whether Azula's brand of genius would have helped her against Jeong Jeong (personally I think she would slaughtered him), but I think it is pretty clear that Bumi could run rings around Toph when it comes to strategy and tactics.
On the other hand, I think that you are wrong about Bumi being better with traditional earthbending. Toph has a natural affinity for the Earth that is unmatched - one has only to watch her fights in "The Bind bandit" to see that.
So it's hard to say with this fight.
titan predator keeps mentioning about the wall of fire. i dont think it is a big deal. anyway, jeong jeong was powerful at the finale, every firebenders were powerful. i think iroh can beat joeng jeong easily. he is the DRAGON of the WEST
he can do lightning, breathe fire, and he is nimble although he has chubby appearences.
A lot of different firebenders specialize in different things:
Jeong Jeong: the best defensive firebending moves.
Iroh: Astonishing sheer, all-round power placed behind whatever move he choses to use. Great understanding of the mechanics of firebending.
Combustion Man: great at blowing things up in a stylish way.
Ozai: all-rounder; has completely mastered every well-known firebending move.
Azula: master of trickery and surprises. Brilliant tactician. Natural affinity for lightning.
Zhao: Jeong Jeong's foil - is a master of offensive manouveurs, but is easy to catch out and defeat.
Zuko: has some pretty sweet moves from all of these catagories, but sadly, compared to his tactical genius sister, Zuko is a tactical idiot. Looks hot.
| Axrendale wrote: |
| A lot of different firebenders specialize in different things: Jeong Jeong: the best defensive firebending moves. Iroh: Astonishing sheer, all-round power placed behind whatever move he choses to use. Great understanding of the mechanics of firebending. Combustion Man: great at blowing things up in a stylish way. Ozai: all-rounder; has completely mastered every well-known firebending move. Azula: master of trickery and surprises. Brilliant tactician. Natural affinity for lightning. Zhao: Jeong Jeong's foil - is a master of offensive manouveurs, but is easy to catch out and defeat. Zuko: has some pretty sweet moves from all of these catagories, but sadly, compared to his tactical genius sister, Zuko is a tactical idiot. Looks hot. |
hahaha every time i watch avatar with my gf, she always says
"OMG zuko is SOOOO hot"
and i get offended
back to topic.
yep, zuko has no plans how or when he will fight. he just makes it up as he goes
| isabelwhatx wrote: |
| I'm starting to think Zuko isn't really that powerful. I mean, I think I only convinced myself he was powerful because he's a main character. Zuko really doesn't have anything that stands out from him. As Axrendale pointed out, Zuko is all alone in the fact he doesn't have a specialty. Even after learning the true meaning of firebending he wasn't THAT good. His only specialty is his training in sword fighting. |
I think that Zuko, as far as bending goes, is a very weak version of Ozai. As I have said, Ozai strikes me as the type who knows no unique moves or strategies of his own, but has completely mastered every commonly used technique (common as in several people use it, like lightning, as opposed to a unique technique like blue firebending or combustion attacks). Zuko is the same, but he hasn't mastered any of them: he's just very good at them all. He is a jack of all trades, master of none.
| Axrendale wrote: | ||
If we were going to resume our Azula/Jeong Jeong argument, I'd point out that during the finale Azula creatted a lightning bolt that was so big it almost dwarfed the Fire Nation Capital City. It doesn't matter how fast Jeong Jeong can move, or what defenses he can throw up - he's not going to survive having one of those land anywhere near him. But we've stopped arguing about that, so I'll move on to Bumi/Toph. You're neglecting the fact that any attack mad by bumi will be sensed by Toph. He can't simply "throw boulders at her" - first he has to rip those boulders out of the ground, which will of course be sensed by Toph, who will know that something is coming. No matter what attack Bumi wants to pull, Toph is going to have some forknowledge of it. Toph's metalbending may or may not be a factor, depending on where they are fighting. I will give Bumi props though, for the same reason that I gave them to Azula - his mind. Bumi is a mad genius who knows all 85 jin and who knows what else. It was unclear whether Azula's brand of genius would have helped her against Jeong Jeong (personally I think she would slaughtered him), but I think it is pretty clear that Bumi could run rings around Toph when it comes to strategy and tactics. On the other hand, I think that you are wrong about Bumi being better with traditional earthbending. Toph has a natural affinity for the Earth that is unmatched - one has only to watch her fights in "The Bind bandit" to see that. So it's hard to say with this fight. |
Well, this is realy my last argument about Jeong Jeong vs Azula. I doubt Azula could dodge those walls I mention earlier. They may not be as powerfull as lightning, but still powerfull enough to kill somebody or destroy building or tanks. And if Azula can't doge (I think she can't) she'll be dead.
And about Toph and Bumi. Well, you are right about Toph sensing Bumi pulling earth out of the ground. But as soon as the boulders are out, she has NO idea with way they are going. But you have to admit, Boulder and Hippo aren't realy very powerfull. They are strong benders, but not masters. So I doub't if Bumi would have more trouble beating them than Toph did. And yes, Toph has the affinity with earth, but I don't think that will be enough the defeat the MADDEST genius in the world. And Bumi also has some very powerfull moves. I think he could also easy put Boulder in a split by earthbending. So Bumi is for me the winner.
Here is my ranking of all the bender together: (I don't include Aang, because in the avatar state he pwns all, and I don't count people who died long time ago like Gyatso because we didn't see him bend alot)
1 Ozai (prior to having his bending removes ofcourse)
2 Iroh (now #1)
3 Bumi
4 Jeong Jeong
5 Sane Azula
6 Toph
7 Pakku
8 Katara
9 Insane Azula
10 Combustion Man
11 Post FBM Zuko
12 Huu the Swampbender
13 Pre FBM Zuko
14 Zhao
15 Boulder
Think I mention everyone in this list.
| Axrendale wrote: | ||
I think that Zuko, as far as bending goes, is a very weak version of Ozai. As I have said, Ozai strikes me as the type who knows no unique moves or strategies of his own, but has completely mastered every commonly used technique (common as in several people use it, like lightning, as opposed to a unique technique like blue firebending or combustion attacks). Zuko is the same, but he hasn't mastered any of them: he's just very good at them all. He is a jack of all trades, master of none. |
| TitanPredator wrote: | ||||
Well, this is realy my last argument about Jeong Jeong vs Azula. I doubt Azula could dodge those walls I mention earlier. They may not be as powerfull as lightning, but still powerfull enough to kill somebody or destroy building or tanks. And if Azula can't doge (I think she can't) she'll be dead. And about Toph and Bumi. Well, you are right about Toph sensing Bumi pulling earth out of the ground. But as soon as the boulders are out, she has NO idea with way they are going. But you have to admit, Boulder and Hippo aren't realy very powerfull. They are strong benders, but not masters. So I doub't if Bumi would have more trouble beating them than Toph did. And yes, Toph has the affinity with earth, but I don't think that will be enough the defeat the MADDEST genius in the world. And Bumi also has some very powerfull moves. I think he could also easy put Boulder in a split by earthbending. So Bumi is for me the winner. |
And I will say again that if Zhao could part Jeong Jeong's walls without effort, Azula can most likely simply walk through them.
It's true that Toph may not be able to see the boulders, but she has other senses too. Her hearing is so good that during the fight at the end of TBB, she was able to pick up on a guy swinging towards her on a rope with a rock in his hand while The Boulder and the Hippo were roaring at her. There is also the distinct possibility that she is quite capable of sensing rocks even when they're detached from the ground - some of the gaang's fights against the Dai Lee in the last few episodes of B2 definitely seem to imply that she can do so.
Let's not bother trying to create an overall ranking of all benders, powerwise. If we couldn't even get a Fire Nation one straight, I doubt we'll ever agree on one for all four nations.
| Axrendale wrote: | ||||||
And I will say again that if Zhao could part Jeong Jeong's walls without effort, Azula can most likely simply walk through them. It's true that Toph may not be able to see the boulders, but she has other senses too. Her hearing is so good that during the fight at the end of TBB, she was able to pick up on a guy swinging towards her on a rope with a rock in his hand while The Boulder and the Hippo were roaring at her. There is also the distinct possibility that she is quite capable of sensing rocks even when they're detached from the ground - some of the gaang's fights against the Dai Lee in the last few episodes of B2 definitely seem to imply that she can do so. Let's not bother trying to create an overall ranking of all benders, powerwise. If we couldn't even get a Fire Nation one straight, I doubt we'll ever agree on one for all four nations. |
Well, as I said before, Jeong Jeongs wall at the river wasn't created to hurt anyone. Just to force Zhao's fleet to land. Zhao said himself "My old teacher gave up fighting a long time ago". And Jeong Jeong kinda confirmed it. So we can asuma Jeong Jeong wasn't trying to hurt anyone there. And as I also stated before, the Comet can't turn a wall of nothing into a tank destroying wall. But maybe whe should stop now about that. I know, I started again. But I had just one argument to make. Didn't want to start the discussion again
And you are right about the flying boulders. I forgot that part. But I'm still convinced Bumi will win. He is a mad genius!
| TitanPredator wrote: | ||||||||
Well, as I said before, Jeong Jeongs wall at the river wasn't created to hurt anyone. Just to force Zhao's fleet to land. Zhao said himself "My old teacher gave up fighting a long time ago". And Jeong Jeong kinda confirmed it. So we can asuma Jeong Jeong wasn't trying to hurt anyone there. And as I also stated before, the Comet can't turn a wall of nothing into a tank destroying wall. But maybe whe should stop now about that. I know, I started again. But I had just one argument to make And you are right about the flying boulders. I forgot that part
|
Actually, on this one I'm inclined to agree with you. Mad geniuses always prevail! Which is why Azula will beat Jeong Jeong...
