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Nickelodeon (ended 2008)

Is Azula a Sociopath?

  • Avatar of xRamensx

    xRamensx

    [61]May 21, 2008
    • member since: 03/01/08
    • level: 11
    • rank: Red Shirted Lt.
    • posts: 2,541

    masterofaeons wrote:
    * Glibness/Superficial Charm - Check. * Manipulative and Conning - Check. * Grandiose Sense of Self - Though she does everything for the honor of the fire nation, she's out of wack. * Pathological Lying - Check. * Lack of Remorse, Shame or Guilt - Azula feels shame. She's not completely dead inside. * Shallow Emotions - Just because she has few, I don't think she can be called shallow. * Incapacity for Love - Electra, anyone? She has the wrong kind of love. Ew. * Need for Stimulation - "What are we going to do tonight, Azula?" "The same thing we do every night, Ty Lee...!" * Callousness/Lack of Empathy - Check! * Poor Behavioral Controls/Impulsive Nature - I would never call Azula impulsive. Maybe we'll see that later, but she has yet to crack. * Early Behavior Problems/Juvenile Delinquency - I hear she tried to bite the midwife. * Irresponsibility/Unreliability - Seriously, this doesn't sound like her at all. * Promiscuous Sexual Behavior/Infidelity - Right, maybe in the live action remake 17 years from now. * Lack of Realistic Life Plan/Parasitic Lifestyle - Not this Azula. * Criminal or Entrepreneurial Versatility - Versatility? "I am a princess who murders people. I don't need a resume." * Contemptuous of those who seek to understand them - She never really got mad at the questions during The Beach, just internalized it and regretted being herself. * Does not perceive that anything is wrong with them - Azula knows she's f****'d up. * Authoritarian - Check. * Secretive - She's never been one to keep a secret. * Paranoid - Azula is collected and assured of herself at all times. * Only rarely in difficulty with the law, but seeks out situations where their tyrannical behavior will be tolerated, condoned, or admired - Ummm...check. * Conventional appearance - I don't think I've seen her dress down. * Goal of enslavement of their victim(s) - I think she stops at "kill (and make daddy happy)" * Exercises despotic control over every aspect of the victim's life - No, she's never gone out of her way to terrorize Aang. * Has an emotional need to justify their crimes and therefore needs their victim's affirmation (respect, gratitude and love) - Now this one wouldn't surprise me in the least. * Ultimate goal is the creation of a willing victim - I'll give her this one. I believe this is the role she sees for Ty Lee. * Incapable of real human attachment to another - Check. * Unable to feel remorse or guilt - No, she regrets her life when forced to reflect. * Narcissism, grandiosity (self-importance not based on achievments) - Azula likes her shiny medals and accomplishments. She is self-made, not a mockery of competence. * May state readily that their goal is to rule the world - And overthrow daddy? Never! --- I think she misses some key factors. One of which is disregarding regret.

    "I hear she tried to bite the mid-wife."

    That reminds me of the book "Wicked" When Elphaba was born, her mother was passed out, so one of the mid-wives let Elphaba suck on her finger. The problem was that Elphaba was born with a full set of teeth and bit the tip of the woman's finger off.

    Anyway. I don't think Azula's completely a sociopath. Though she's definitely on her way. Azula doesn't know how to feel remorse because she's never had a reason to, and she didn't get the same, loving attention Ursa gave to Zuko. Zuko also away from his home for three years, and saw the ravages of what the war had done. And even Zuko didn't seem to care until he was seen as traitor and was on the run from Azula and really had to face the effects of war.

    I think if Azula was put in a similar position to what Zuko had been in, she'd be able to pull away from those sociopathic tendencies.

    Which is why I still love the idea of Hobo/Nomadic!Azula.

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  • Avatar of PsychoPass

    PsychoPass

    [63]May 21, 2008
    • member since: 11/05/07
    • level: 11
    • rank: Red Shirted Lt.
    • posts: 2,302
    xRamensx wrote:

    masterofaeons wrote:
    * Glibness/Superficial Charm - Check. * Manipulative and Conning - Check. * Grandiose Sense of Self - Though she does everything for the honor of the fire nation, she's out of wack. * Pathological Lying - Check. * Lack of Remorse, Shame or Guilt - Azula feels shame. She's not completely dead inside. * Shallow Emotions - Just because she has few, I don't think she can be called shallow. * Incapacity for Love - Electra, anyone? She has the wrong kind of love. Ew. * Need for Stimulation - "What are we going to do tonight, Azula?" "The same thing we do every night, Ty Lee...!" * Callousness/Lack of Empathy - Check! * Poor Behavioral Controls/Impulsive Nature - I would never call Azula impulsive. Maybe we'll see that later, but she has yet to crack. * Early Behavior Problems/Juvenile Delinquency - I hear she tried to bite the midwife. * Irresponsibility/Unreliability - Seriously, this doesn't sound like her at all. * Promiscuous Sexual Behavior/Infidelity - Right, maybe in the live action remake 17 years from now. * Lack of Realistic Life Plan/Parasitic Lifestyle - Not this Azula. * Criminal or Entrepreneurial Versatility - Versatility? "I am a princess who murders people. I don't need a resume." * Contemptuous of those who seek to understand them - She never really got mad at the questions during The Beach, just internalized it and regretted being herself. * Does not perceive that anything is wrong with them - Azula knows she's f****'d up. * Authoritarian - Check. * Secretive - She's never been one to keep a secret. * Paranoid - Azula is collected and assured of herself at all times. * Only rarely in difficulty with the law, but seeks out situations where their tyrannical behavior will be tolerated, condoned, or admired - Ummm...check. * Conventional appearance - I don't think I've seen her dress down. * Goal of enslavement of their victim(s) - I think she stops at "kill (and make daddy happy)" * Exercises despotic control over every aspect of the victim's life - No, she's never gone out of her way to terrorize Aang. * Has an emotional need to justify their crimes and therefore needs their victim's affirmation (respect, gratitude and love) - Now this one wouldn't surprise me in the least. * Ultimate goal is the creation of a willing victim - I'll give her this one. I believe this is the role she sees for Ty Lee. * Incapable of real human attachment to another - Check. * Unable to feel remorse or guilt - No, she regrets her life when forced to reflect. * Narcissism, grandiosity (self-importance not based on achievments) - Azula likes her shiny medals and accomplishments. She is self-made, not a mockery of competence. * May state readily that their goal is to rule the world - And overthrow daddy? Never! --- I think she misses some key factors. One of which is disregarding regret.

    "I hear she tried to bite the mid-wife."

    That reminds me of the book "Wicked" When Elphaba was born, her mother was passed out, so one of the mid-wives let Elphaba suck on her finger. The problem was that Elphaba was born with a full set of teeth and bit the tip of the woman's finger off.

    Anyway. I don't think Azula's completely a sociopath. Though she's definitely on her way. Azula doesn't know how to feel remorse because she's never had a reason to, and she didn't get the same, loving attention Ursa gave to Zuko. Zuko also away from his home for three years, and saw the ravages of what the war had done. And even Zuko didn't seem to care until he was seen as traitor and was on the run from Azula and really had to face the effects of war.

    I think if Azula was put in a similar position to what Zuko had been in, she'd be able to pull away from those sociopathic tendencies.

    Which is why I still love the idea of Hobo/Nomadic!Azula.



    Azula appears to still have the ability to... how do I say this... well... I hate being at a loss for words. >_> I guess what I'm getting at is, she acts like a sociopath because it's required of her but overall she isn't an actual sociopath. Excuse my lack of being able to convey my thoughts properly but do you kind of see what I'm getting at?
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  • Avatar of sqevans

    sqevans

    [64]May 21, 2008
    • member since: 09/04/05
    • level: 5
    • rank: Caveman Lawyer
    • posts: 162
    Azula needs a goal to focus on.
    It's when she's adrift, not knowing what to do, that she loses it.
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  • Avatar of xRamensx

    xRamensx

    [65]May 21, 2008
    • member since: 03/01/08
    • level: 11
    • rank: Red Shirted Lt.
    • posts: 2,541
    PsychoPass wrote:
    xRamensx wrote:

    masterofaeons wrote:
    * Glibness/Superficial Charm - Check. * Manipulative and Conning - Check. * Grandiose Sense of Self - Though she does everything for the honor of the fire nation, she's out of wack. * Pathological Lying - Check. * Lack of Remorse, Shame or Guilt - Azula feels shame. She's not completely dead inside. * Shallow Emotions - Just because she has few, I don't think she can be called shallow. * Incapacity for Love - Electra, anyone? She has the wrong kind of love. Ew. * Need for Stimulation - "What are we going to do tonight, Azula?" "The same thing we do every night, Ty Lee...!" * Callousness/Lack of Empathy - Check! * Poor Behavioral Controls/Impulsive Nature - I would never call Azula impulsive. Maybe we'll see that later, but she has yet to crack. * Early Behavior Problems/Juvenile Delinquency - I hear she tried to bite the midwife. * Irresponsibility/Unreliability - Seriously, this doesn't sound like her at all. * Promiscuous Sexual Behavior/Infidelity - Right, maybe in the live action remake 17 years from now. * Lack of Realistic Life Plan/Parasitic Lifestyle - Not this Azula. * Criminal or Entrepreneurial Versatility - Versatility? "I am a princess who murders people. I don't need a resume." * Contemptuous of those who seek to understand them - She never really got mad at the questions during The Beach, just internalized it and regretted being herself. * Does not perceive that anything is wrong with them - Azula knows she's f****'d up. * Authoritarian - Check. * Secretive - She's never been one to keep a secret. * Paranoid - Azula is collected and assured of herself at all times. * Only rarely in difficulty with the law, but seeks out situations where their tyrannical behavior will be tolerated, condoned, or admired - Ummm...check. * Conventional appearance - I don't think I've seen her dress down. * Goal of enslavement of their victim(s) - I think she stops at "kill (and make daddy happy)" * Exercises despotic control over every aspect of the victim's life - No, she's never gone out of her way to terrorize Aang. * Has an emotional need to justify their crimes and therefore needs their victim's affirmation (respect, gratitude and love) - Now this one wouldn't surprise me in the least. * Ultimate goal is the creation of a willing victim - I'll give her this one. I believe this is the role she sees for Ty Lee. * Incapable of real human attachment to another - Check. * Unable to feel remorse or guilt - No, she regrets her life when forced to reflect. * Narcissism, grandiosity (self-importance not based on achievments) - Azula likes her shiny medals and accomplishments. She is self-made, not a mockery of competence. * May state readily that their goal is to rule the world - And overthrow daddy? Never! --- I think she misses some key factors. One of which is disregarding regret.

    "I hear she tried to bite the mid-wife."

    That reminds me of the book "Wicked" When Elphaba was born, her mother was passed out, so one of the mid-wives let Elphaba suck on her finger. The problem was that Elphaba was born with a full set of teeth and bit the tip of the woman's finger off.

    Anyway. I don't think Azula's completely a sociopath. Though she's definitely on her way. Azula doesn't know how to feel remorse because she's never had a reason to, and she didn't get the same, loving attention Ursa gave to Zuko. Zuko also away from his home for three years, and saw the ravages of what the war had done. And even Zuko didn't seem to care until he was seen as traitor and was on the run from Azula and really had to face the effects of war.

    I think if Azula was put in a similar position to what Zuko had been in, she'd be able to pull away from those sociopathic tendencies.

    Which is why I still love the idea of Hobo/Nomadic!Azula.

    Azula appears to still have the ability to... how do I say this... well... I hate being at a loss for words. >_> I guess what I'm getting at is, she acts like a sociopath because it's required of her but overall she isn't an actual sociopath. Excuse my lack of being able to convey my thoughts properly but do you kind of see what I'm getting at?

    Tis ok. I know what you mean.

    Yeah, she saw what happened to Zuko when he spoke against Ozai. She's not dumb; she knows how to stay on people's good sides. And after 14 years of acting like, it most likely sort of bore itself into her brain that it's ok. Doesn't mean she not redeemable.

    That being said; is Azula does get redeemed, it has to be done very well. It can't just like "okayz, she iz good nao!" Azula will have to go through a major character development process. Zuko had to go through a lot to get where he is now.

    Someone on CAPSLOCK mentioned that if Avatar had a couple more seasons, Azula would probably get redeemed, but since it's ending, she probably won't. Again, just because we don't see it, doesn't mean it won't happen. I know the fanficcers will go nuts for that sort of stuff.

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  • Avatar of smartipantz101

    smartipantz101

    [66]May 21, 2008
    • member since: 08/24/06
    • level: 4
    • rank: Thighmaster
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    sociopath: a person, as a psychopathic personality, whose behavior is antisocial and who lacks a sense of moral responsibility or social conscience (amoral).

    sadist: a person who gains gratification through causing pain or degradation to others.

    .... so, whether or not Azula is a sociopath depends on if you think shes immoral or amoral (immoral=going against your morals. amoral=having no morals). She's definately a sadist though.

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  • Avatar of masterofaeons

    masterofaeons

    [67]May 22, 2008
    • member since: 05/12/04
    • level: 15
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    No, she's neither. Azula is a cold-blooded woman who does whatever daddy tells her to. As PsychoPass said, she's not actually that person, it's just expected of her and she's gotten good at filling that role. Whenever reflecting though (as we saw in The Beach), she laments the disapproval her choices have given her. She's not antisocial and she has morals, however twisted by the Fire Nation.

    She has never relished the fact that she is hurting others. She just does her job and is proud to make the Fire Nation (or daddy) stronger. The only person she likes hurting is Zuko and believe me, everyone likes getting the better of their sibling. When bearing down on others though (such as weaker members of other nations) she doesn't CARE what she's doing. She's completely detached from the acts she commits. The only people that matter is her and the Fire Lord. If another is in her way, she intimidates them into cowing or breaks their will and reminds them that they have no sympathy from her as they are nothing. "You weren't even a player."

    So, no. By no means has she ever been sadistic. She's a businesswoman who just wants daddy to pat her on the head and say "Thank god you're not Zuko."
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  • Avatar of L0717

    L0717

    [68]May 22, 2008
    • member since: 01/09/07
    • level: 10
    • rank: Holy Level 10!
    • posts: 325
    masterofaeons wrote:
    L0717 wrote:

    cg_619 wrote:
    Azula is the ultimate Villian!

    AIZEN TAICHO!!!

    Way better villian.

    way.

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  • Avatar of Rockstar-Qaasim

    Rockstar-Qaasim

    [69]May 22, 2008
    • member since: 04/21/08
    • level: 5
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    KInda, Jayson marries her at the end...
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  • Avatar of yogi_tulsii

    yogi_tulsii

    [70]May 24, 2008
    • member since: 08/14/06
    • level: 6
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    • posts: 500
    L0717 wrote:

    i hate her short-tempered tantrums.

    When does she ever have short-tempered tantrums other than the boiling rock? She's always so calm, so cool, so manipulative.

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  • Avatar of Hiz_Wifey101

    Hiz_Wifey101

    [71]May 24, 2008
    • member since: 07/27/07
    • level: 10
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    "the beach"

    -See Caroline all the guys would say she's mighty fine
    But mighty fine only got you somewhere half the time
    And the other half either got you cursed out, or coming up short

    -See she's the reason for the word "whitch"

    -Well she's got a hotty body, but her attitude is potty
    When I met her at a party she was hardly acting naughty
    I said "Shorty, would you call me?"
    She said "Pardon me, are you ballin'?"
    I said "Darling, you sound like a prostitute pausing"

    ---Roses by outkast

    XXD

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  • Avatar of L0717

    L0717

    [72]May 24, 2008
    • member since: 01/09/07
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    yogi_tulsii wrote:
    L0717 wrote:

    i hate her short-tempered tantrums.

    When does she ever have short-tempered tantrums other than the boiling rock? She's always so calm, so cool, so manipulative.

    exactly. i especially didnt like her in BR.

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  • Avatar of BlindWatcher400

    BlindWatcher400

    [73]May 24, 2008
    • member since: 05/14/08
    • level: 5
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    Azula is not a sociopath.

    She's the love of my life.

    Animated or not, I love her like I love the sun.

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