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The Earth Knigdom is not so bad...

  • Avatar of BiSheng

    BiSheng

    [1]Oct 2, 2006
    • member since: 09/23/06
    • level: 6
    • rank: Small Wonder
    • posts: 179
    First to critics of starting a new thread: this does not belong in one of the four stickiest. I'm not asking a question, this is not about a ship, it's not a spoiler or speculation, or a discussion of a specific episode. Plus I looked and this has not been stated in depth in another thread.

    Recently there have been several disparaging remarks made against the Earth Kingdom because of the recent revelation that Ba Sing Sa is a police state. I would like to take this opportunity to first point out that this is an ethnocentric view (ethnocentric: using your culture as the norm from which all other societies are judged. Just because the Earth Kingdom society is slow to react and different from your own nation does not mean that it's bad. The creators have portrayed it as adversarial to the Avatar's mission, and thus it is understandable to view it as evil, but it is not.

    Besides this, none of the other nations are any better. Let's compare it to what we know about the nations using the same ethnocentric lens:

    Water Tribe:

    1. Sexism: This runs rampant in the society; even Sokka, in the pilot, is guilty of it.

    2. Small and therefore weak: the Southern Water Tribe can't be much bigger than a hundred people judging by the size of the village that remained after the warriors left. The Northern Water Tribe seems to have only a few thousand members.

    3. Illogical: The Southern Water Tribe men all abandoned their village, leaving it vulnerable to attack.

    Fire Nation:
    1. Expansionist and militaristic: The Fire Nation puts itself above all other nations as superior. Corollaries can be drawn between the worst aspects of American/Capitalist Society as well as Nazi Germany. This also means that they are responsible for the loss of balance to the world.

    2. Violent and Barbaric: the Fire Nation elite still settle their differences in personal combat, and assassination, while not accepted, seems to occur.

    3. Elitist: The Fire Nation looks to be set up on the caste system with royalty at the top, military next, mercenaries next, and commoners and businessmen on the bottom. (We have only seen the top three so far, but I am confident that I have the placement correct)

    Air Nomads:
    1. Extinct (weak): Since the Air Nomads are no more this indicates that the society was weak and unable to organize itself to face the threat of the Fire Nation

    2. Inhumane: It is revealed (or at least hinted at) in the pilot that Air Nation children have no fathers or mothers and are raised by the monastery. By our standards this is VERY inhumane treatment.

    Earth Nation:
    1. Bound by Tradition: Earth society, in all it's forms, is bound by tradition and precedent that makes it slow to react to changing conditions.

    2. Elitist: The Earth Kingdom is shown to have an extensive caste system similar to the fire nations: Nobility before, administrators, scholars and military, and commoners below that.

    3. Fragmented: The Earth Kingdom has split itself between at least two kings that we know of. There is no unifying government to present a untied front against the Fire Nation.

    It seems to me that no nation is far above the others, and that, on balance, the Earth Kingdom is actually a desirable place to live, given the alternatives.

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  • Avatar of KilalaRose

    KilalaRose

    [2]Oct 2, 2006
    • member since: 03/26/06
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    well said, though i do think you exaggerated just a few things, such as the men of the Southern Water Tribe abandoning their homes. i wouldn't say they abandoned them. technically, they were trying to protect them by fighting in the war, which would hopefully keep them from harm. i would also like to say that the airbenders are not inhumane just because air nation children are left to live in monasteries. in the monasteries they are taught the gentle way of life, preferring peace over fighting. and not all airbenders would grow up to be monks and nuns. (if they did, then where would all the children come from?) and just because airbenders were wiped out does not mean they are weak. Aang had stated that the only way you could get to an air temple was by a bison (which we find is not true) but that means no one was expecting the attack. and as i mentioned before, airbenders have a more peaceful nature and did not have a military group/army. but that's pretty much all i have to disagree with. everything else is well done.
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  • Avatar of Colonel_Brian

    Colonel_Brian

    [3]Oct 2, 2006
    • member since: 05/15/06
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    C'mon the FN isn't that vulgar they have senses too.. Well the EK is okay I mean it's corrupted for the most part and there's barly any towns cause of vast swamps, deserts and other georophy.
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  • Avatar of phoenixfirework

    phoenixfirework

    [4]Oct 2, 2006
    • member since: 07/26/05
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    The kids of the FN are being brainwashed to support the war. Did you see that puppet show in that FN town in "The Deserter"? You can't exactly blame the common people of the FN who support the war since their brainwashed into accepting it.
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  • Avatar of blitzwing17

    blitzwing17

    [5]Oct 2, 2006
    • member since: 04/26/05
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    I completly agree. They are also the only nation that stands up to the fire nation and has a small rebellion. It seems that the water nation is wating for the war to blow over, and the air nation(whatever is left) must be in hiding.

    Besides the earth kindom has cool moving doors. If only they could get them to have the star trek *whoosh* sound, i would move there right away.
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  • Avatar of Eman5805

    Eman5805

    [6]Oct 2, 2006
    • member since: 11/05/04
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    of course the EK isn't so bad...Earth Kingdom is Forever .

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  • Avatar of niceguyposer

    niceguyposer

    [7]Oct 2, 2006
    • member since: 08/25/06
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    If you consider pacifism a weakness, then that's another con to living among the Air Nomads.

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  • Avatar of Colonel_Brian

    Colonel_Brian

    [8]Oct 2, 2006
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    Eman5805 wrote:

    of course the EK isn't so bad...Earth Kingdom is Forever .

    Untill it is burned

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  • Avatar of Paisho

    Paisho

    [9]Oct 2, 2006
    • member since: 09/27/06
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    Each society ihas its dark sides, it doesnt neceesarily mean its bad (except the FN ??)
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  • Avatar of metalcurtainrod

    metalcurtainrod

    [10]Oct 2, 2006
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    Colonel_Brian wrote:
    Eman5805 wrote:

    of course the EK isn't so bad...Earth Kingdom is Forever .

    Untill it is burned



    YUP
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  • Avatar of sly4me

    sly4me

    [11]Oct 2, 2006
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    I can't stand the Earth Kingdom. Except for Jin and Bumi. Oh yeah,?? Toph...
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  • Avatar of Colonel_Brian

    Colonel_Brian

    [12]Oct 2, 2006
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    metalcurtainrod wrote:
    Colonel_Brian wrote:
    Eman5805 wrote:

    of course the EK isn't so bad...Earth Kingdom is Forever .

    Untill it is burned

    YUP

    Don't be counting on it.... you may never see the day when that happens you have a sentance.....and anyway fo FN!

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  • Avatar of MajehKing

    MajehKing

    [13]Oct 2, 2006
    • member since: 07/06/05
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    A climatic clash between Earth and Fire benders would be a sight to behold. I think Ba Sing Se is in for a very rude awakening.
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  • Avatar of KilalaRose

    KilalaRose

    [14]Oct 2, 2006
    • member since: 03/26/06
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    MajehKing wrote:
    A climatic clash between Earth and Fire benders would be a sight to behold. I think Ba Sing Se is in for a very rude awakening.
    they definitely need it.
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  • Avatar of Colonel_Brian

    Colonel_Brian

    [15]Oct 2, 2006
    • member since: 05/15/06
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    MajehKing wrote:
    A climatic clash between Earth and Fire benders would be a sight to behold. I think Ba Sing Se is in for a very rude awakening.

    But I wonder how it will be handled I mean they don't know anyhing about the war or there not allowed..and what happens if the FN come sover their walls with war baloons they won't be prepared!

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  • Avatar of Eman5805

    Eman5805

    [16]Oct 2, 2006
    • member since: 11/05/04
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    Colonel_Brian wrote:
    Eman5805 wrote:

    of course the EK isn't so bad...Earth Kingdom is Forever .

    Untill it is burned

    Over my bending body

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  • Avatar of Colonel_Brian

    Colonel_Brian

    [17]Oct 2, 2006
    • member since: 05/15/06
    • level: 12
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    Eman5805 wrote:
    Colonel_Brian wrote:
    Eman5805 wrote:

    of course the EK isn't so bad...Earth Kingdom is Forever .

    Untill it is burned

    Over my bending body

    So be it??...I gave up the war I'm no longer a General so we might lose....anyway they stand no chance.

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  • Avatar of robinhawk77

    robinhawk77

    [18]Oct 2, 2006
    • member since: 03/26/06
    • level: 10
    • rank: Holy Level 10!
    • posts: 251
    BiSheng wrote:
    First to critics of starting a new thread: this does not belong in one of the four stickiest. I'm not asking a question, this is not about a ship, it's not a spoiler or speculation, or a discussion of a specific episode. Plus I looked and this has not been stated in depth in another thread.

    Recently there have been several disparaging remarks made against the Earth Kingdom because of the recent revelation that Ba Sing Sa is a police state. I would like to take this opportunity to first point out that this is an ethnocentric view (ethnocentric: using your culture as the norm from which all other societies are judged. Just because the Earth Kingdom society is slow to react and different from your own nation does not mean that it's bad. The creators have portrayed it as adversarial to the Avatar's mission, and thus it is understandable to view it as evil, but it is not.

    Besides this, none of the other nations are any better. Let's compare it to what we know about the nations using the same ethnocentric lens:

    Water Tribe:

    1. Sexism: This runs rampant in the society; even Sokka, in the pilot, is guilty of it.

    2. Small and therefore weak: the Southern Water Tribe can't be much bigger than a hundred people judging by the size of the village that remained after the warriors left. The Northern Water Tribe seems to have only a few thousand members.

    3. Illogical: The Southern Water Tribe men all abandoned their village, leaving it vulnerable to attack.

    Fire Nation:
    1. Expansionist and militaristic: The Fire Nation puts itself above all other nations as superior. Corollaries can be drawn between the worst aspects of American/Capitalist Society as well as Nazi Germany. This also means that they are responsible for the loss of balance to the world.

    2. Violent and Barbaric: the Fire Nation elite still settle their differences in personal combat, and assassination, while not accepted, seems to occur.

    3. Elitist: The Fire Nation looks to be set up on the caste system with royalty at the top, military next, mercenaries next, and commoners and businessmen on the bottom. (We have only seen the top three so far, but I am confident that I have the placement correct)

    Air Nomads:
    1. Extinct (weak): Since the Air Nomads are no more this indicates that the society was weak and unable to organize itself to face the threat of the Fire Nation

    2. Inhumane: It is revealed (or at least hinted at) in the pilot that Air Nation children have no fathers or mothers and are raised by the monastery. By our standards this is VERY inhumane treatment.

    Earth Nation:
    1. Bound by Tradition: Earth society, in all it's forms, is bound by tradition and precedent that makes it slow to react to changing conditions.

    2. Elitist: The Earth Kingdom is shown to have an extensive caste system similar to the fire nations: Nobility before, administrators, scholars and military, and commoners below that.

    3. Fragmented: The Earth Kingdom has split itself between at least two kings that we know of. There is no unifying government to present a untied front against the Fire Nation.

    It seems to me that no nation is far above the others, and that, on balance, the Earth Kingdom is actually a desirable place to live, given the alternatives.



    don't forget about the swampy water benders... that's a society... maybe.
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  • Avatar of arthuroys

    arthuroys

    [19]Oct 2, 2006
    • member since: 10/01/06
    • level: 3
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    • posts: 114
    phoenixfirework wrote:
    The kids of the FN are being brainwashed to support the war. Did you see that puppet show in that FN town in "The Deserter"? You can't exactly blame the common people of the FN who support the war since their brainwashed into accepting it.


    It's not really brainwashing so much as it is propaganda, something every country past and present has been guilty of doing - even if their war was just and righteous.?? Propoganda is simply an inevitable aspect of the war on the home front.
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  • Avatar of Miroku_of_Nite1

    Miroku_of_Nite1

    [20]Oct 2, 2006
    • member since: 01/09/05
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    There is nothing really wrong with the Earth Kingdom, it is just Ba Sing Sa is a police state with a side of The Giver thrown in for effect. Ba Sing Sa figures if they can keep the peoples minds off of the war the people wont start revolting on other issues. But since there is a lot of refugees in Ba Sing Sa, I am sure they don???t mind a lot of the stuff they got to put up with. There is nothing wrong with the people there, just the government.
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